2.1 on a Verizon Pre Plus: my experience 81
When Rod Whitby and his webOS Internals colleagues announced that the recently-released O2 2.1 webOS Doctor could be utilized via MetaDoctor to create 2.1 distributions for legacy devices, I was intrigued. When users took this possibility and turned it into easy-to-run scripts for various carriers and devices, I was inspired. When one of those scripts turned out to be Verizon Wireless and the Pre Plus, my own combination, I was off and running.
I've played with MetaDoctor before, so I was already set with Oracle VM's Virtualbox and a Ubuntu virtual machine, needed because the MetaDoctor tools and instructions are primarily designed for Linux. (Note that, for users like me running 64-bit Windows 7, there can be some Novacom driver challenges that make it a bit more complicated--check the various wikis and fora for more info.) Per the wiki, I deleted my earlier MetaDoctor installation, reinstalled it, and followed the very clearcut instructions. It was a lot of fun to watch as the script download and merged what appeared to be three different webOS Doctor versions: the Verizon 1.4.5, the new Verizon 2.01 for the Pre 2, and the O2 2.1:
Happily, the MetaDoctor creation process completed without a hitch. I connected my Pre Plus (having fully backed up the USB partition and everything else I could in advance), ran the new MetaDoctor, and waited while it rewrote my Pre Plus' operating system. It completed, the Pre Plus rebooted, and hey! Isn't that an HP boot logo? Yep, I was now running webOS 2.1. I followed the instructions to restore my Palm Profile before unmasquerading my device (again, read the Wiki for information). While my accounts automatically installed, my apps did not, but I easily redownloaded those I needed without having to pay again for them.
Here, then, are my brief impressions of 5 days running webOS 2.1 on my Verizon Wireless Pre Plus:
Favorite Things: The vast majority of my apps work just fine. One can now do Orange/Grey-Sym-P screenshots of PDK apps too, which helps me in my PreCentral work:
E-mail client improvements are subtle but real: I especially like the built-in "confirm to delete" (no patch needed) and even more so the fact that in my Favorites, the contents of folders, not just inboxes, automatically update. I also like voice dialing, which works well both with spoken numbers and names, assuming the background noise isn't too loud. Flash works, although you need to follow Jason Robitaille's instructions to manually install it. Based on my initial tests (and confirmed by James Harris of GPS Fix fame), whatever Palm has put into webOS 2.x has truly improved hardware GPS access on the Verizon Pre Plus. And yes, Bluetooth keyboard support works, for both SPP and HID devices, so my ThinkOutside UltraThink Keyboard can finally get some use...sort of. (See below.)
Least Favorite Things: The rewrite of the launcher means that, at least for now, it's impossible to even patch it to show 4 icons across; I'm back to the really big icons I started with in 2009. The new App Catalog looks fancy, but does not (as far as I can tell) allow me to see a full list of apps sorted by date, which I prefer; the overall date view only shows a limited number, and I have to guess the category of the app I might be interested in to see a longer list. For now, PocketMirror remains incompatible with webOS 2.x, but I've been told directly by Chapura that an update is imminent.
To be Determined: Before Palm releases the source code for webOS 2.1, the wizards behind UberKernel could not release a new version, so 2.1 users were stuck without true overclocking (although Govnah can push your Pre Plus to a fixed 600 mHz speed). As a result, my Pre Plus was a bit slower than usual for many tasks. I've now installed the new UberKernel, and am seeing marked improvement. Additionally, while Bluetooth keyboard support does work, it's flaky, and I suspect a faster processor may help smooth out typing response, and I hear some music skipping when multitasking that wasn't there before. There are fewer patches than I'm used to (for now); patch writers have to update and/or resubmit their patches to show up in the 2.1 Preware feed. VZ Navigator is not yet installable (although with the GPS improvements, I don't miss it, since I only used it to trigger the GPS!). [UPDATE: THE LATEST VERSION OF THE VZW SCRIPT DOES IN FACT INSTALL VZ NAVIGATOR BY DEFAULT, ALTHOUGH ITS FUNCTIONING IS BEING EVALUATED.] Finally, what happens with future updates, whether OTK or downloaded, is still unclear.
Bottom Line: If you are a Pre Plus owner (the original Pre has half the RAM, so while others have had good experiences, I'm not assuming mine is reflective of what would happen with a regular Pre) and comfortable with basic Linux use, and are remotely adventurous, definitely consider upgrading to 2.1. Be sure to read all available information, especially the warnings about possible inability to revert your Palm Profile back to 1.4.5, and to back up your USB partition (and use Save/Restore before that) to preserve as much of your environment as you can against mishaps. For my part, I'm very pleased as to how it's going, and don't plan on trying to go back to 1.4.5.
81 Comments
very informative. I could not get meta doctor to work at all. I put in the commansa and it started the process but when I did step 7 nothing. I had to use cy. I have windows vista 32bit. Any help?
It's really awesome that webOS internals pasted all this together. They also did it very quickly although that may be more of an illusion. If they did as quick as many of us perceive, it begs the question: Why did Hpalm not paste this together themselves and release it to the dedicated. Not OTA, but downloadable with disclaimers etc.?
Because they would have to support legacy devices along with the up coming crop. If there were any issues with the older devices that is additional resource taken away from the folks working on the pending releases.
Because ALL the carriers for whom they released an official Doctor would have to approve.
That's my guess. I just think it's too bad that H/Palm can't just come out and say, "Dudes, we want to, but the carriers are being snots about it."
i think that has to be it. there was obviously VERY little work left to be done by HP to release upgrade for all Pre+ users worldwide; in fact it would not surprise me to learn that HP had already given the updates to the carriers, and they all said 'no interest'. Among other things I suspect the carriers balked at having users flash the phones from their computers instead of getting a nice, safe, OTA update.
Maintaining good relations with the carriers though prevents HP from throwing them under the bus like they should.
"Maintaining good relations with the carriers though prevents HP from throwing them under the bus like they should."
Word.
seconded
because at least speaking from experience with the Sprint Pre, performance on 2.1 is absolute garbage. I'd rather use an iPhone than deal with how slow 2.1 on the Pre was.
Overclocked though (I'm running @ 1.005GHz screenstate) it's better. There are still certain apps that feel significantly slower than they were on 1.4.5, like the camera app. Weigh the pros and cons, and decide for yourself if some slow apps are worth dealing with to have all the amazing new webOS 2 features.
2.1 + overclocking = renewed optimism for me, I now have a device that I'm OK with using until the veer comes out (which I plan on buying unlocked and using until the Pre 3).
I thought there was a post a day ago about unixpsycho releasing kernels? The source is available now.
EDIT: Found it: http://www.precentral.net/overclocking-kernels-webos-2-1-now-available-s...
2.1 + F105 on Sprint Pre- = True love.
This phone is now killer, so a Plus must be even better.
That is all.
@MrPerry I had problems with cywgen. I had to use Virtualbox & ubuntu. I'm on win 7 though. Try VB (virtual box)
ok thanks!
I need to learn how to use the regular doctor first I think. mostly cuz i'm really busy this month lol
Yes. Users need to get familiar with installing novacom, getting it running, and using a regular doctor before diving right in with meta-doctor.
I wont do all this heavy lifting till there's a simple doctor to download and install webOS 2.1 fully functional.
This will never happen, so don't wait for it. It's illegal to redistribute HP's code. There's just a few commands you have to input into your Linux system to have a fully functioning and legal modified doctor.
Then you'll be waiting on H/Palm and your carrier to agree to release one. webOS Internals can't redistribute a custom 2.1 Doctor for legal reasons.
making the doctor is by far the easiest part. even if someone made one for you to download, it wouldn't save you much.
Great article!
Is your Hotspot still free, though? Does Verizon see you as 2.1 or 1.4.5, and does it make any difference in their billing?
That's kinda the kicker for me since the Hotspot is my main internet source for right now--and I'd like to keep it free, if at all possible.
read the caveats section on the webOS 2 upgrade wiki page: http://www.webos-internals.org/wiki/WebOS_2_Upgrade
+1 +1 +1 +1 +1 +1
NEVERMIND THIS POST - FALSE ALARM... MHS WORKS GREAT on 2.1, AND CHARGES DATA PROPERLY
uhoh, it may be panic time about MobileHotSpot. MobileHotSpot works, BUT it appears to use the regular phone data allowance rather than the special HotSpot data allowance. I dropped my regular phone data plan down to 150MB, as I very rarely use data on the phone itself (just enough for e-mail and the occaisional map) - the only time I use much data is for MHS, and that has a separate 5GB data allowance.
I just checked my verizon account, and it appears that when I tested MHS on monday night after completing the meta-doctor, the data I used went against my phone data allowance - it shows several blocks of phone data used at exactly that time, while my MHS usage remains at zero.
Must investigate further, but this appears to be really bad news for me.
For those with an unlimited phone data plan on verizon, it probably won't make any difference.
I should ammend my comment that it may not matter to verizon users with unlimited phone data plans:
this raises the concern now that something doesn't work quite the same, and is treated differently by verizon, which in turn raises the concern that verizon could notice and call shenanigans. I *suspect* now that MHS data just looks like phone data to them and they'd have no reason to notice the difference as long as you don't abuse it and run up 30GB of data usage. However the fact remains that something is now different.
hi there, can you check again your usage? I am still on 1.4.5 and when i use MHS, sometimes it is charged against my phone data usage, but after a few days, it will change and it will eventually be charged into the MHS data usage.
thanks!
you know, I was wondering about that very possibility today. I couldn't understand why, if the hotspot worked, it would not use the right data allowance; if it doesn't login the right way, then it ought not to work at all.
so, let's mark this is a potential false alarm, and allow me to check my verizon account again tomorrow.
yeah, you're right. I just checked again, and sure enough the data usage has been moved over to the MHS side of the ledger.
I had originally thought maybe this was the case, but as it had been over 36 hours between the time I used MHS and the time I checked the vzw site, I figured any re-allocation would have been done by then. it turns out it needed a few more hours.
thats great news! thanks for getting back in this thread :D
SACRILEGE!!! This CANNOT be!! Legacy PRE's do not have the hardware abillity to run WebOS 2.x. It came straight from God's voice!! How dare you call Rubenstein a liar!! Strike down that Golden Calf Pre Plus immediately. Recant and buy a PRE 2 less you be struck down by Ruby's wrath!!
they don't. Performance on the Pre on 2.1 is absolute garbage without overclocking. Obviously you're not going to get HP shipping out a doctor with a 1GHz overclock, since not all phones can handle it and it hurts battery life a bit.
If you hate HP/Palm so much what are you doing on this blog? Go buy some boring Android phone already.
Am I the only one who thinks it's insane that people are whining about HP not continuing to support a phone that is closing in on two years old?
How are your temps at 1GHz with 2.1? I'm still waiting for my apps to reinstall since running the magical doctor. Plan to OC when they're done.
I have to disagree. I've used the spint pre with 2.1 and I have to say that my device was still running it pretty decently. It was a bit sluggish at times, but nothing that would make it unusable.
Now that I am overclocking it really is very snappy, and I am enjoying it greatly.
PS Love the stacks!
suburban, I'm with chertik0ff.
I thought 2.1 performance was surprisingly good, with the exception of some lags and freezes with lots of open cards that I presume were due to slow retrieval from the compressed cache.
But your other point is undeniable. The overclocked 2.1 Sprint Pre- (I'm running Thunderchief) is absolutely outstanding.
But what was your setup for that? Keep in mind that anything optimized in Uberkernal or any other kernal would not be there with an offical release from HP. Regardless of if it's possible to make it work better with those modifications HP can only release based on officially supported development. They can let the homebrewers do their thing but they can't do official releases based on what the homebrewers can do.
Just finished running the modified Doctor on my Pre(-) - not nearly as complicated as it appeared to be. LIKE IT! Will be donating later today!
My favorite feature by far is Just Type + Quick Actions. I've found it very intuitive to incorporate this into my workflow for making calls, send text messages, going to urls, etc.
I'm wondering if there's a way to use Quick Actions to add a text Shortcut . . . that would be handy.
What do you mean be a text shortcut? A link to a url?
Jonathan,
Are you a VZW Nav user? We still need someone to test that and mark it as "working with subscription service" before we mark it as done.
I have used it in the past, Ed, but don't currently have a subscription, sorry. I would be willing to sign on for a short period to test, but that might also mean re-re-metadoctoring, since I re-metadoctored before the new script. I'd rather not go through that again two days in a row.
I did, though, plan on installing just those files and trying it directly. I may PM you if I make progress. {Jonathan}
My experience to a t. Yes, you definitely lose the no-extra-charge hotspot feature application, but graphics hardware acceleration in 2.1 is sweet. No more laggy launcher scrolling! Don't forget verizon users, if you have a backup verizon Palm Pixi Plus or Pre Plus, feel free to swap it back on to your account (with a new/alternate Palm Profile) to regain use of your 5GB Hotspot feature. Even though I lost hotspot on my Pre Plus after installing 2.1, I just keep a Pixi Plus handy in case I need to activate it for a short period of time to use the hotspot. Exemplary work Internals!
no, you DO NOT lose the hotspot app. this was only the case a several days ago, before the new scripts were released. currently, ALL verizon apps are installed by lifting them from the VZW Pre2 2.0.1 doctor (publicly available). I think the only possible hold-up on the VZNav app is that no one actually has a subscription with which to test it... but it does install and launch.
when I did my meta-doctor, the VZW apps were only installed if you ran the 'new-meta-verizon-preplus-2.1.0' script. if not already, then soon the standard 'meta-verizon-preplus-2.1.0' will include all the apps as well.
"ALL verizon apps"?
That's a lot of capital letters in that word.
Skype is not included in the metadoctor, at least as of your post.
As for VZ Nav, I've already tested it with 2.1.0 with a subscription and mentioned so in the previous P|C post. However, I installed it manually. (the metadoctor wasn't including vz nav/mhs/etc when i last tried the VZ script, so I can't confirm that it works out-of-the-box after using the VZ meta script yet. (However, I can't see why it wouldn't.))
COMPLETE aside:
Strangely, I used metadoctor in a way i've used it dozens of times before -- to redo my 1.4.5 device. But now its all screwed up. Carrier apps didn't install. Says 'EV' instead of '3g' in the top. This, somehow, makes me unable to login to yahoo, or use MHS (says I don't have the feature all of a sudden). Odd, and annoying. (I think everything else is workinn fine though.)
It seems like there were some changes in metadoctor for 2.1 that affected the way it works for "normal" metadoctor operations. This is unfortunate. *sigh*
What about releasing 2.1 for the Pre 2 for Christ's sake? I've been using one now for 3 months and the previous gen hardware has a more up to date than the flagship? What is that about? Is there a timeframe for the 2.1 update?
exactly my thought. I have been checking my unlocked Pre2 every other day for several weeks now.
i am just going to wait for the pre 3 or another new webos device coming out.. I have a pre- and i dont think i would want to get a pre+ unless it was given to me for free.
Hey guys ... where's the Pre 2 Review?
If you haven't already, when do you plan on reviewing the phone?
Thank god for the overclock kernals. My experience with Webos 2.1 on my Pre- got about 100 times better.
Jonah... I find it slightly inappropriate that you in a published article ask readers (that might be less educated about whats going on behind the scenes than many of us) to go figure out stuff themselves when it would take you a sentence and a half to briefly explain it — like what (un)masquerading is. No need to refer people to a wiki they might not be able to find, just to understand what you are writing about.
I understand the essence of the article are for the more technical crowd, but many others are probably also reading the article — like engadget staff, or iPhone users. 8o)
BTW: check your wording;
"... but I easily those I needed without having to pay again for them".
Masquerading: http://www.webos-internals.org/wiki/WebOS_2_Upgrade
Not hard to find at all. :-)
Wording checked and fixed, thanks.
There was a link to the main forum posting earlier in the piece, which in turn refers folks to the wiki, and I would rather those who want to try this make the effort to learn all they can before doing so, rather than trusting my user's-level explanations in a blog posting. {Jonathan}
I know you did, but as mentioned iP-users are used to dumbed down experiences. We got to cover them to. 8oÞ
2.1 on AT&T also fixes a data connection drop problem that I was having. Nice not having to toggle Airplane Mode on multiple times a day.
Uberkernel is working rather well, still not 100% perfect.
Flash is also working well on legacy hardware.
I'm having two issues right now, 1) I can't get the system to accept the unmasquerading command in any way and 2) I am unable to install any patches.
I have Windows 7 64 bit, and everything was running fine until I started trying to do this.
Can someone help me figure out why I either can't get novacom to initialize on Cygwin or can't get the file to transfer on webos quick install.
Quit lessing the pre's its extremely **** The Pre Minus now this **** Its the Pre. bottom line. Soon I guess you will call it the digital breakdown and a reassembly device. "New software for the digital breakdown and reassembly devices"
The final one will be new software " for the electrons between the air that form something else" But you can still pretend your blatantly clever and but not really and think some female who deosn't exist thinks its cute and write (hint*hint* a phone)
The pre minua was the pixi, for obvious reasons.
Ok I need some serious help. I have tried following the wiki webos upgrade page and I am totally lost.(I actually thought I would be able to do this easily) I have spent roughly 5 hrs trying to figure it out and I am completely lost. If someone could please email me so I can get a bit of help that would be wonderful. If no one has the time I understand, but I would deeply appreciate it. Jeffrey3605@hotmail.com THANKS IN ADVANCE!
can i download preware on palm pixi plus? and what is it for?
Yes for the pixi plus. You have to install preware manually (connected to a computer). It is the homebrew application installer for non-app catalog stuff like homebrew apps and patches. Simply one of the best management apps for WebOS.
Here is a good page to look at:
http://install.preware.org
Awesome, thanks so much for posting! Your environment sounds identical to mine and I got stuck @ the modified doctor recognizing my Sprint Pre-. It must be that I'm running Windows 7 64-bit. I thought when it said special instructions were needed to install Novacom for 64-bit it meant my Ubuntu version. I'll go back to that & try again. Instructions from the community are great though!
Can Derek write a similar post for his Sprint Pre-? :-D :-D :-D
It's probably possible to get Ubuntu to see a Pre or Pre Plus directly, but I found it much easier to move the relevant files from the build directory in Ubuntu to a volume Windows could see, and run them from there. {Jonathan}
I looked at that too but couldn't figure out how to mount a shared volume. After combing through forums for a while, I had to go to bed.
Can anyone suggest a good walkthrough?
I forgot to say that, while it's subjective, battery life seems to be better than ever under 2.1, especially considering the CPU is cranking at a gig.
Jonathan, are you familiar with the experience of any Sprint Pre users that already "plussed" their phone by putting a Sprint comm board into a VZ Pre Plus? If so, are their experiences similar to yours?
Good read. Although I am completely comfortable using all those things, I think I am going to wait until the source code comes out and the good people at Internalz can make an even better version.
Even after reading this & searching the forums I still have a few questions:
1. Is it possible to manually backup & restore all (or most of) the data that one would lose from disabling backup of the palm profile
2. Is it possible to revert your palm profile back to 1.4.5 after doctoring & unmasq-ing it at 2.1?
3. Does the verizon script auto-install mobile hotspot?
4. Can you purchase 2.0 apps from the app-store? (koto-player is the only one I actually care about..)
1. yes, but it's not automatic for everything. if you have contacts in your palm profile (ie, not from Google, facebook, etc.) you need to get the 'e-mail all contacts as vcf" patch (not the exact name, but you'll find it), and then you can send yourself an e-mail with your contacts attached. once I got my contacts, I just imported them into a Google account so I don't have to worry about them any more. for the rest of the apps, the webos internals save/restore app does a good job. some things you won't be able to save, like your call history, memos (I think), a few other things. I didn't lose anything I cared about.
2. if you do things correctly, your profile will stay on 1.4.5. that's the whole point of masq'ing - you login to your profile telling the palm server you're on 1.4.5, and then unmasq to 2.1.0 only after your initial login. if you foul up and get a 9.99.99 version profile, then you have to doctor back to 1.4.5, log back in to your profile to fix it, turn off backup again, then upgrade again to 2.1.0.
3. yes. it works perfectly.
4. no. the app catalog believes you are still running 1.4.5. there's no resolution for that yet - palm's servers simply won't allow an invalid combination of device/carrier/webos version.
hey thanks a lot for taking the time! =]
Johnsonx42...I meta-doctored my Verizon Pre Plus to 2.1 successfully. But, I DIDN'T get Mobile Hotspot with the scripts, for some reason. I just did it yesterday (3/1), so I'm assuming I had the latest version (meta-verizon-wireless, etc.)
Any ideas why I'm not getting MHS? It's the ONLY part of the package that didn't install the way I wanted it to. I got all my apps, my phone is fast enough (without being overclocked, although I may eventually add that.
Do I have to go all the way back to 1.4.5 and try again? Or, is there an easier way to just put MHS on the system by itself?
I even pulled the .ipk out of the Meta-Doctor file, and tried to install it with Preware. It DOES install (the icon is there), but it doesn't work when invoked, and it disappears when I reboot the phone.
Ideas?
All I can presume from what you're saying is that you did your git of the meta-doctor before all the scripts were updated fully. either that, or a bug has been introduced somewhere.
I suggest you remove or rename your existing meta-doctor director, do a new git "git clone git://git.webos-internals.org/tools/meta-doctor.git"), and run the meta-verizon-preplus-2.1.0 script then re-doctor your phone. no, you don't have to go back to 1.4.5 first.
if MHS still doesn't work, then report in the big 2.1 upgrade thread and hope you get the attention of EdCates & rwhitby. http://forums.precentral.net/webos-internals/276460-how-install-webos-2-...
I think I'd try it with my Sprint Pre with overclocking except I use the Sprint Navigation and the issues with the PRL. Will probably do it before I upgrade. Like to be able to try 2.0 outside of a store before I'd commit to upgrading to the Pre³ assuming it is available on my carrier.
bjohnsonx42...that's what I did...and it worked perfectly. I'm not sure what I did differently (I don't think anything, actually). But, I now have a fully functional 2.1 Palm Pre Plus. In fact, it loaded Amazon mp3, VZNavigator AND MHS, along with a couple other apps I didn't realize I missed on the previous image.
Thanks for the help.
Damn. I would have switched instantly, if it weren't for the lack of USB contacts/Calendar sync. No companionlink, no webOS 2.x for me. C'mon Palm, release those specs to CL and Chapura already..!
Just converted, a little more tedious than i thought, but still pretty straight forward. Palm profile sync'd properly, and it didnt format. All my music and pictures were still there, but my angry birds data is gone... (probably the only app i have that has save data anyway, so i really dont care).
Preware and the necessary overclocking tools are set up. The screenstate kernel doesnt work too well though... it doesnt realise when the screen turns back on, so it stays at 250 until i manually put it back. Now, im running at a locked 800, still super smooth.
Even when Chapura comes out for 2.x, it still won't be installable on a FrankenPre, right? Won't the 2.x version be unavailable to the FrankenPre because the device will still register as a 1.4.5 device? I thought the only way we could get 2.x apps on an unofficial device was if (like DanPLC is doing with Remix) the developer released a special IPK that advertises as 1.4.5 but really was a 2.x app.
[Expletive removed]! Here I was finally considering taking the plunge to WebOS 2.1 on my Pre+ ..... now that Chapura has V2.x apps out there.
But ... from my read of the Wiki, posts, etc... it sounds like only the 1.x Chapura version will be downloadable with the App Cat (which will not work).
Well -- that saves me from having to brush up my rusty Unix/Linux commands for the time being.
Regardless: stellar work on the part of WebOS Internals on bringing us the scripts we have so far.
Can anyone verify that the pop3 email bug is fixed in 2.1?
Hey, I have a Verizon Palm Pre that I don't really care about because I am going to be getting a new phone soon anyways, and I have other phones lying around in case I severely mess up my Pre, so basically I don't really care if I mess it up. I have a lot of free time this weekend that I can spend on this. Anyways I really want to try putting 2.1 onto it, but I have never done anything like it before. I have never used Metadoctor or really anything listed in the instructions. I have grown up with computers so I am pretty familiar with them, I can learn/ pick up on things quickly and follow instructions well, so I'm sure I could figure it out with little help, I'm just not sure where to start. I haven't done anything to my Pre except I have Preware, Govnah and have it overclocked. Can anyone point me in the right direction on where to start? Threads/write ups that have specific instructions? I know you have to be familiar with this kind of stuff to do it, so how do I become familiar with it? Like I said I have time to read up on this stuff, I just need someone to point me in the right direction. Any help would be gladly appreciated. I love this site and webosinternals. I definitely check this site multiple times a day and read all the articles, they are very helpful and informative. Thanks,
Howie
if it is the carriers fault, an we expect the same sort of outdated device issue that android has?? I hope not. I want my device to receive updates for 2-3 years.
i was just wondering how hard is it to install this webos 2.0 on my palm pre plus
How well is mobile hotspot working with this upgrade?
Hey I'm using a O2-Germany Pre(-) with WebOS 2.1. Mobile Hotspot works out great.