Personal comparison: Pre 2 and Pre3 on Verizon | webOS Nation
 
 

Personal comparison: Pre 2 and Pre3 on Verizon 66

by Jonathan I Ezor#IM Sun, 09 Oct 2011 7:41 pm EDT

As a Verizon Wireless customer since the company was called NYNEX, and as someone who went from the Pre Plus to the Pre 2 (the latter courtesy of the "Oprah Moment" at last year's New York webOS Developer Day) on Verizon, I was extremely eager to upgrade to the Pre3 (what I mostly wanted was the autofocus camera and the slightly larger screen for my aging eyes) when it came out. And then it didn't. And then it did...sort of. And then I got one (through a source I will not discuss, sorry). And then I waited two weeks while Verizon wasn't able to activate it (the MEID didn't register). In the meanwhile, I bypassed activation and tried to at least connect to a profile using Impostah, without success. Happily, once the VZW Doctor was released, I was able to use Impostah, and then finally, a week or so ago, the MEID finally went through and I was finally able to switch to the Pre3 as my daily phone.

Derek has already published a comprehensive (and phenomenal) Pre3 review, so rather than reinvent that particular wheel, I thought I'd instead provide a brief comparison of the experience on Verizon of my Pre3 and its predecessor, the Pre 2. Specifically, here are the sharpest differences between the two otherwise very similar (fast, modern, Gorilla Glass-covered) webOS phones (continued after the break)...

Screen: In most situations, the additional screen real estate (480x800, vs. 320x480) is very welcome; widescreen movies display better, and mobile Web sites are in fact easier to read. Sometimes, though, the stylesheet of a particular Web site will make the text smaller on the Pre3, which was not a pleasant surprise. (The non-mobile version of The New York Times' site is one example.) Otherwise, the Gorilla Glass continues to provide a solid and comforting feel (all the more comforting given the irreplaceability of the Pre3).

Cameras: Yep, two. The rear one, with its auto-focus, enables closeups and QR code scanning just as I'd hoped. The front-facing one, added for the Pre3, works decently for Skype, although it must be oriented in landscape mode.

Speed: As fast as the Pre 2 is, especially when overclocked, the Pre3 is just a step beyond. Apps launch more quickly, screens scroll faster, and the device is just overall much more responsive.
webOS 2.2 features: Touch-to-share works, but I have found very few practical uses for it. Pairing for both messages and phone calls works too, but given the battery hit from the Bluetooth connection, I haven't used it much either.

Design: I've never had a problem with Pre-sized keyboards (or even the Veer's smaller keys), but the Pre3's larger keys are a nice feature for my large fingers. The slightly recessed switches and USB port took some getting used to, but they're quite functional. Similarly, it took a few days for my hand to get used to the larger, flatter (my Pre 2 has the Seidio extended battery back) Pre3, but there too, it no longer catches my attention. Both the Pre 2 and Pre3 are built solidly.

World phone: While the Pre3, like all Verizon phones, is CDMA, it also has a SIM slot beneath the removable back. This should mean that it's a worldphone, able to use GSM networks outside the United States. I haven't yet tested this, but I'm hopeful I'll get a chance to do so.

GPS: Here, the changes are revolutionary, rather than just evolutionary. For all the problems with the Verizon Pre Plus' GPS, and for the modest improvements in the Pre 2's GPS, let me say for the record: the Pre3's GPS is stellar. When turned it, it gets a high-accuracy fix almost instantly, without any need for workarounds like James Harris' excellent GPS Fix, and every location-based app, from Foursquare to Navit to others, can access it. I can finally use location-based apps whenever, and however, I want to, without worrying about delays or reboots.

Accessories: While the Pre3 can use the standard webOS Touchstones for charging, its flatter back causes it to stick less well, especially in portrait orientation. A forum member came up with a really good solution using flexible magnets, which substantially enhances the adhesion of the Pre3. More troubling, the aborted marketing means there are few if any dedicated accessories for the Pre3. Given that it will not be replaced if it breaks, I'd really like a hardcase and screen protector, but I'm having a great deal of difficulty finding one.

Problems and missing features: As wonderful as is the Verizon Pre3, there are still some problems and omissions. One I'm truly missing is the ability to trigger the LED flash as a flashlight; that's something I do frequently with my older Pre phones. According to my Precentral colleague Jason Robitaille, who created the standard patches for that, the Pre3 uses a different control mechanism for its flash, so the existing patch/Torch app don't work. Jason's been trying to get information on the new control elements to update his patch, but has been unsuccessful to date. Other patches are slowly being updated to support the Pre3, so it's worth checking Preware on a regular basis for new ones. Most apps work fine, but there are a few issues: some PDK apps (notably EA Games' Battleship and Monopoly) show some odd graphical glitches, while other apps have blank areas rather than filling in the additional screenspace. Many apps are not (yet) available for the Pre3, either because they just don't work on it, or because the developer has not yet updated the app's description in the App Catalog to indicate Pre3 compatibility. That said, the vast majority of my daily use apps are available and work very well.

Here's the bottom line: If you're a Verizon Wireless customer, you have an earlier webOS phone (even the Pre 2), and you can find an affordable Pre3, get it. Unfortunately, there seem to be even fewer Verizon Pre3s "in the wild" than AT&T versions (probably because the AT&T version is GSM, like the Euro-spec ones, while the Verizon Pre3 has a different, CDMA radio, so it may have been made in lower quantities).

I'll close by adding my voice to the many who lament the cancellation of this verycompetitive smartphone, and who urge new HP CEO Meg Whitman to rush them back into production. With the Pre3, the folks at HP/Palm got it right.

Category:

66 Comments

Too bad any left are soooo expensive on ebay!

Lets get HP to build one for Sprintj "now".

Sprint... if only. The whole Sprint / webOS debacle is what pushed me to Android back in April. Little did I know then that that was a good move. I left webOS very begrudgingly, as I guess most do. Android has it's pluses. The app selection is off the charts good and the homescreen/widget setup almost mitigates the loss of webOS elegance. Damn HP! Damn Sprint! Damn HP mostly.

Good article Jonathan! Makes me long for the Pre 3 on Sprint that never was. Damn HP!

Can the 'Verizon' CDMA Pre3 be activated on Sprint?

no.

technically yes, but in reality no.

It has to do with the Sprint policy (I have heard rumors VZW is no longer following the same policy) of not activating ESN's that aren't *approved* for their network.

Technically the phone would function if you could get the ESN in the system.

I used my brothers android for last 3 days, short comparison, I love the webOS UI, but the android internals rocks. Switching btw apps and ease of use cant be surpassed on webOS but when it comes to dependability of maps, gmail, calendar or a link from gmail to browser android rocks. Why cant google buy webOS and make android and webOS one. Take webOS openness and ease of use and marry it with android sturdiness

Uhh, no.

Google, please stay away from webOS.

ugh YES!

Google PLEASE buy WebOS and incorporate its awesome synergy, live multitasking and live cards into Android. PLEASE!

if amazon gets it WebOS is sure to get stripped down and chopped to pieces.

amazon is a SHOPPING and CONTENT DELIVERY service. most of the features that make WebOS great are of no use to them.

WHO watches a movie, plays music, reads a book, and plays a game all at the same time? amazon has NO NEED for multitasking in the way it is in WebOS. the best you can hope for is some very limited form of it... like browser windows in iOS. he11 amazon even stripped android down!

No dude, if anything one of the big Android manufacturers should buy webOS and make it their mobile OS. Samsung or HTC could do great things with webOS. BUT, don't want webOS being thrown into Android. THAT is getting stripped down and chopped to pieces.

Code can't just be merged, obviously. Different languages, different API calls, different development frameworks, and different user interface metaphors.

Merging ideas from each user interface is possible, however, one must be careful of creating a Frankenstein's Monster of user interfaces in the process.

I would prefer webOS stay pure to its interface design, and have someone with money, content, steadfastness, and brand recognition to buy it. You know, like Amazon. :-)

Hi all,

I want to thank you for the excellent report.

I too gave a great deal of thought to trying to obtain a Pre3 with the help of friends in Europe....

The tipping point against it is the simple fact is there will be few apps written for a phone that most people ever even heard off.

I still have a little while to go with my trial time with my Samsung Epic....I want to see if webOS does find a buyer this week as rumor has it....

Even then, won't it take time for a phone to be built or modified and apps to written?

Take care,

jay

Jay - You really should try the iPhone 4S with the new Siri voice assistant. It got some great reviews: http://thisismynext.com/2011/10/04/iphone-4s-hands-on-impressions/

He's too much of an idiot. He can't be helped..

Picked up the Sprint Galaxy SII this weekend. I was always willing to accept lackluster hardware to have the WebOS goodies. But this hardware is so far ahead of anything HP has made, so fast and so smooth, with so much battery life,....it can't be expressed.

Even if someone, anyone picks up WebOS, it will be a year before they have their first phone ready, if they even want to get into that in the first place. Probably two years before they have a competitive, fully sorted, fully API'd handset. Just watching the GPU do it's thing on the G SII makes it clear. Samsung made a complete package and you know they're well into developing the third generation devices right now.

Picked up the Sprint Galaxy SII (...) this hardware is so far ahead of anything HP has made, so fast and so smooth, with so much battery life,...."
true, true....

"Even if someone, anyone picks up WebOS, it will be a year before they have their first phone ready"
I don't think so, HTC has Android phones out in the wild, running on the same chipset as Pre 3 (don't remember, was it HTC Sensation??), also Pre3's screen resolution is standard Android 480x800 (for better or worse), so I can't imagine in my wildest dreams that it would take a company like HTC more than 2-3, maybe 6 months (max), to put webOS on it, IF someone came to them and say "m'kay, here's the deal, we want you to manufacture 2 millions of these, with the possibility to produce more, if it catches on - here's the money". I think even Samsung wouldn't necessarily say "no" to this kind of arrangement, even if they are not interested in webOS itself - but they do not shy from manufacturing re-branded stuff. For HTC - this is bread & butter.

If we are talking about vertical sliders, that would be longer, I suppose, since there aren't any out there, anywhere close to Pre 3's specs...

Uh, there's the matter of getting an effective 800x480 onscreen keyboard made up from scratch, designing hardware with a gesture area, tuning batteries, etc.

Then, PHONE/2.x apps have to be updated for optimal control on devices with NO hardware keyboard, and....well, we're talking yet another complete reboot while the rest of the market moves further and further ahead.

Also, the "ecosystem" would consist of HTC Watch or Samsung Media Hub level **** which will appeal to few. Same as the "HP Movie Store".

"Uh, there's the matter of getting an effective 800x480 onscreen keyboard made up from scratch"
...yeah, impossibly complicated piece of software indeed... Also, not like they would be able to pick any of the existing, promising soft keyboards made by few people startups/hobbyists, buy it for spare change, and use in a matter of weeks... Or use commercial third-party keyboards/APIs, provided by ones like for example Swype...

"designing hardware with a gesture area"
true, that is the only task that would be different from the run of the mill Droids they are capable of producing in tens every year. Don't think it would be too much of a challenge, somehow, cuz they seem to be able to produce capacitive touch buttons all right.

"tuning batteries"
...a WHAAA?!?! Tuning BATTERIES, goodness me... And tunning them to what, cosmic frequencies, or maybe your vibes? Jerrydan, please stay in the realm of your spreadsheets and penny counting, because my sides hurt from laughing, whenever you try to sound "technical"

"Also, the 'ecosystem' would consist of HTC Watch or Samsung Media Hub level **** which will appeal to few"
...like "HTC watch" is appealing to a "few", like HTC build quality is appealing to even fewer... right...

That is but another option for webOS, that I am repeating. Start small, with phone (phones), with focused products, put your actions before your talks. Show long-term commitment (do not boast about it, rather SHOW it, and yes, by definition, it would have to take time). Build trust (do not ASK for trust, rather EARN it). Build mindshare. Do not aim to became "no. 1 plus", and most importantly - do not babble about it. Just do your stuff, make some marginal profit (or not), let the product speak for itself for a while. Like in: longer than 40 days, like in: for a realistic prices. Both of which, companies like HTC (and other OEMs) are not only capable of, but best on the market.

Samsung is doing well with their Bada phones. I know that in your opinion webOS is the worst thing that happened to humanity since the Black Death and bombing Hiroshima, but your agreement aside(as not really significant nor well informed), webOS is "a tad" better/more sophisticated platform than Bada is. There's no reason why well-built, reasonably priced phones, running it, would not sell well (if not fantastic).

Everyone, to a single one Apple lover, that I demoed webOS to, said it is cool/interesting/fantastic/"why I have never heard about it" (by the way, the "why I never heard about it", addresses AGAIN your beated to death argument, constantly repeated here (and addressed multiple times), about "multi-million marketing campaign(s)", that webOS owners were willing to cough up for. You can waste multi-millions in many different ways, bad marketing is but one of them).

Am I starting to break in, at least a bit, into your spreadsheet world, with your foresight horizon of "today" only?

Im still waiting patiently too. If HP continues w/WebOS I want a Pre3 on VZ I will hold out till the FINAL DECISION of WebOS is made!

Jason just tweeted a short while ago that the LED flashlight has now been updated for the Pre3.

BTW, I want your source...

wow, very cool. I've been missing the led flashlight since switching to the pre3. I used it all the time on my pre+.

The Pre3, where waiting on a flashlight app is big news...

-Suntan

It's not big news, it's just "it's there now dude".

Twitter is your friend:

@JayCanuck - Jason Robitaille
2 hours ago
Many thanks to mpx on PreCentral forums. Thanks to him, LED Torch, SysToolsMgr and my LED flash patches will come to the Pre3 :)

Ahhh I can't believe it. I just got a brand new Palm Pre 3 for only 168,00 Eur = US$ 229 from Ebay here in germany.

I thought about getting another iPhone or try the Pre 3. Can't wait to get my hands on my new Pre?

What about you guys in the US? Are you able to get Pre's? Should we send you a package?

US230 for an unlocked Pre 3? The WebOS flagphone?

AMAZING.

BTW: Fxck You HP!

I'll take that trade.

yes, no problem getting unlocked AT&T Pre3's here. there are over 100 for sale on ebay every day, prices settling now at $200-$230.

VZW pre 3's not so much... only 3 or 4 offered at any one time, $599 and up.

Yet that's too expensive for the webOS crowd. Maybe if it drops to 99.

...I'd say that whatever crowd is buying them, is buying them quite steadily at ~200 prices (€/$, depending on the side of the pond).

$599 for a swan's song phone, with mainstream specs? No thanks.

...but that's just the chekmate and his $99 hiccups

For screen protectors there are several companies here in Germany that offer them for the Pre3. So far I haven't seen full body protectors.

For the screen there are the EXiM protectors (the dim version='UltraProtect', clear='UltraClear' as well as a polarized='Blickschutzfilter' version) from http://www.displayschutzfolien.com/?cmd=geraetAngebote&name=Pre 3
They offer international shipping! By the way I don't work for them but you should know that the owner of the company has also a german handheld/Palm forum (http://www.nexave.de/forum/).

On eBay Germany you'll find other offers like e.g. the 3M Vikuiti protectors which are also good. I'm sure most of them would ship to countries outside Germany and Europe.
Search for '3M vikuiti pre3' to find them (don't forget to activate search on International eBay or eBay Germany).
I just wouldn't buy the cheapest 3M Vikuiti version...there is most likely a reason that they are so cheap. ;)

can't wait to get mine in the next day or so!

Like Jonathan, I've been on Verizon Wireless since before it existed. In my case my account goes back to the final days of PacTel Cellular, then it became AirTouch, and finally Verizon Wireless.

However two weeks ago I gave up on the idea of a VZW Pre3, and bought an unlocked AT&T Pre3, intending to port out my number to T-Mobile. Verizon was not at all cooperative with me even though my wife's phone is still on Verizon and I offered to put a different phone on my account to replace my Pre+ and fullfill my contract. The CS rep was apologetic and understanding, but insisted there was nothing she or any manager could do. If I wanted my phone number on another carrier, the only choice was to break my contract and pay the ETF. Period. Holding my phone number hostage is clearly a policy designed to make it harder for people to leave, even temporarily (I originally planned to come back in a year or two, when either webOS will be back from the dead again, or I'll have given up and am ready to go iOS, android, or winphone.)

So that's how it is... I'm on t-mobile, my wife is on Verizon for another 12 months. The minute her contract is up, I'm canceling my Verizon account altogether. Good riddance if they won't help out a 15+ year customer.

I also have a Pre3 (German, QWERTZ) and I love it too, it's what Palm needed to build 2 years ago. I've just started to fool around with the voice dial feature and it's pretty cool, better than I hoped for.

Grab em up guys, they won't be there for long.

..2 years ago it's chipset wasn't even available for R&D evaluation kits, let alone mass production - get real, people...

Ok, something close then. Pre- was outdated the day it came out but I still loved mine and thought it was better than anything else I had tried- including iphone.

But chipset aside, the physical size, the build and feel of Pre3 is... well, it's like holding a breast in my hand- I'll never tire of it and always be able to figure out some way to have fun with it.

Did I really say that? Yes, yes I did...

Pre- was outdated the day it came out

Really? List exactly which phones all had better specs when it came out. Sorry, your memory is faulty. It was a top of the line phone June 2009. Things have just changed a lot since then.

" It was a top of the line phone June 2009. "
...bar build quality and a software that wasn't ready for a prime time, until few updates, and most importantly - it was already just barely "OK" with screen size/resolution.

Per today's WSJ it looks like HP's PC business is going to stay with HP, there won't be any spinoff. And I am mostly sure then that HP is not going to dump the mobile business, because without mobility PC business won't be able to compete. And HP likely won't use others' mobility tools when they already have functioning mobility tools, viz. TouchPads and Pre-s. Let us see what happens.

Could you elaborate on that? I'm not challenging you, I'd just really like to know what you know about this. Thanks.

I've been a verizon customer since the days of New York Telephone with the ginormous motorola 1.5 lb cell phone. When my 2nd (refurbished) pre+ had tech problems (extended warranty) Verizon replaced it w refurbished pre 2's Ive gone through three units, each with problems, I not quite ready to give up and move a different platform, just bought a fleabay touchpad, but maybe I should try a few more units (perhaps I can get a refurb pre3) sigh....

If HP wants to bring this back... HP needs to realize a few things:

1) Your stuff isn't as desirable as Apple or Android stuff. Price accordingly. For example, the Touchpad should've retailed for $299.99 when it first came out. They priced it at $499.99. Even at $299.99 it's a toss up for most people looking at that vs the iPad2. Expect to lose money increasing webOS users. First thing you need to do is increase users, even if you lose money. Once you have a good sized user base, you get a good sized 3rd party developer pool. Then you get more users because of the apps, then you can charge more.

2) Do market research on what devices people want for god's sake. People wanted the Pre3, not the Veer. Heck, if anything people want bigger devices. Slap the person who came up with the Veer and punch the person who decided the Veer was a priority over the Pre3.

3) Work on cleaning up the OS before you add any more core features. The OS is elegant and functional. And it's totally rough. So rough new users look at it and think it kind of sucks cuz it's so unpredictable acting. it sucks to show a friend your phone or tablet and you launch an app and it takes 20 seconds to load. Or you try to connect to WiFi and it won't let you but everyone else connects just fine.

4) Apps. You want to make the app market have as much compatibility as you can. Meaning don't have apps that are Veer only, Pixi only, Pre/Pre+/Pre only, Pre3 only. This is also why it helps to have everything have the same aspect ratio (or make it easy for app makers to make their apps to handle different resolutions).

I agree on all, but number 2 is absolutely nail-on-the-head accurate. The rest are all true, but perhaps a little extreme (considering there surely are a lot of circumstances that all us fans aren't aware of).
But Veer first? I'd love to hear an explanation of why someone decided that should release first over Pre3.

presumably because it was ready first. all the Veer required was the same basic webos 2.1 that was already available on the pre2. it had the same size screen as the pixi, and the rest of it was more-or-less Pre2.

the Pre3 needed some bigger changes to webos, due to the bigger screen. it also has a front-facing camera that was new to webos. so more time was needed to make webos 2.2 ready.

don't get me wrong, HP/Palm still should have made the Pre3 a much bigger priority and gotten it out sooner. Had the Pre3 launched in May, it could have saved webOS (how many of us certainly wanted a touchpad at some point, but were waiting to get the Pre3 first?). but the Veer coming first was simply natural. and while it wasn't the phone 'everyone' wanted, there's plenty of people that really like it.

Plenty of people that really like it? Do you really think you can say that? I mean I'm pretty sure it sold terribly. I haven't seen one truly positive review of it (by that I mean a review that says "Yeah, it's a good phone and you should really consider getting it"). Most reviews say "Yeah, it's ok I guess, but c'mon there's better phones. If you HAVE to get it, I guess it's fine." Some reviews are much harsher on it.

And I remember Amazon dropping the price to 1 cent pretty soon after the release. And even with that I don't think it sold very well.

The Pre3 needed more work than the Veer for sure, but it doesn't change that much. Resolution change (which Palm has experience in; they did from the Pre to the Pixi after all), and the processor change (should be easy), and the camera changes (auto focus, and a front facing; trickier because they also have to add in API hooks). Still, I don't see it taking a dedicated team more than 1 month to do this (and then 1 month of testing/bug fixing).

"presumably because it was ready first."
...it doesn't matter what was ready, it mattered A LOT what message they were sending to all the interested stakeholders by releasing a stupid phone that nobody wanted, and calling it a lifeline for webOS, that was already tumbling down. They needed to release an utter **** phone (something that Pre 3 is not)

I agree on all. I did buy a Veer because it was the only webOS phone available at AT&T. Can't say I hate it but compared to the Pre3 I bought from Germany the Veer sucks.

And you are right, if Pre3 had come out before the touch pad things would look very different now; HP would probably still be building mobile products.

You have to lay a lot of the blame at Rubenstein's door. He was all over the Veer, it looked like he was pushing it - they would have been much better to forget about the Veer and used those resources to complete the Pre 3 in double quick time. If Ruby had taken his head out of his **** long enough to read the reviews of the February event, he would have seen that everyone was buzzing about the Pre3. It had the state of the art processor, superb screen for the time etc. They wasted all that buzz and goodwill, just wasted it.

He appeared on about 5 shows, giving no clue as to release dates and looking smug. he should nt have appeared without concrete times, all that late summer balls just annoyed people. Focus on one product at a time and make it shine.

" If Ruby had taken his head out of his **** long enough to read the reviews of the February event, he would have seen that everyone was buzzing about the Pre3. "

Really? Because as I remember it, he said something along the lines of "Here's the Pre 3" at the February 9 event and the response was disappointed silence and a few claps.

He then had to "C'mon! Yeah! It's ok!" to induce some polite followup applause.

That's buzz?

Honestly webOS doesn't get a lot of buzz in general. But you have to remember that the announcement WAS a disappointment to a lot of people. People wanted a large uber powered device (after all the Atrix with its dual core processor was already announced and just about to come out) with a new form factor. What was announced was a tiny very mid range powered Pre (aka the Veer). And then a larger decently but not amazingly powered Pre. Basically dashing all hope for a flagship device to make Apple or Android sweat, and dashing all hope for a new form factor.

But after the hands on the vibe I got was

Veer: "I'm really not sure why they made this though. Who's actually going to buy this? It's way too small with underwhelming specs and no headphone jack built in? It is funny to look at though."

Pre3: "Wow, this might be webOS done right! webOS fans, this may be the phone you've been waiting for! I'm actually excited about this!" (Josh of Engadget/This is My Next/Verge pretty much said he was looking at that to be his next phone).

Touchpad: "Has potential. Not sure if it's the right time, but has potential."

As one passenger on the Titanic said to another; "Let's rearrange the deckchairs and get a better view..'

Man, talk about scraping the barrel as far as what to write about. Vaporware vs. a product that should have stayed Vaporware.

Sad but true. Can i just get webos to dualboot on my Epic PLZ? Even if its a 1.4.5? Oh well :(

Does anyone know if the better GPS is due to better hardware or software changes in 2.2? If it is the latter, then I really hope that 2.2 get pushed out to us Pre 2 user at some point.

And the reviews are in! The iPhone 4S is pretty awesome and the new Siri voice assistant function is a game-changer:

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/10/12/technology/personaltech/iphone-4s-conc...

http://thisismynext.com/2011/10/11/iphone-4s-review/

Jonathan - how did you get vZW to add the MEID of your Palm Pre 3 to their system. I tried and they gave me the business saying that they could not and would not do it.

Any help you can provide would be appreciated.

Thanks...Tich

"I'll close by adding my voice to the many who... urge new HP CEO Meg Whitman to rush them back into production"

Oh, right, as if ANY carrier will ever offer an HP device again after they way they got burned on this.

That is the big question now, isn't it?

IF HP does an about face how long would it take to get Pre3 out to market?

AND will anyone (carriers) even bother to give them the time of day?

I'll say it again; HP has botched this as badly as it could be botched. Long delays to launch, no launch fanfare, no carriers, and really, no heart in it at all. I think they decided in early May that they didn't think that mobile products were the future. Can you imagine anyone who isn't severly retarded thinking that? It's not just Leo Medicineman, but the majority of the Board of Directors at HP... Maybe they are still using lead crystal to drink out of in the board room, and they've all got lead poisoning and mental retardation.

(No offense to anyone in special ed, special olympics, or in any other way physically or mentally handicapped.)

My question would be why are you guys still holding a torch for WebOS... it is dead...comput.....never gonna see the light of day every again. I was a Palm faithful for a decade and in one swoop it was all gone. I mourned but have moved on. Do the same guys... this is about as said as the guys who sit around wish Linux was the OS of choice on all computers.

And yet you're still reading the articles (and the comments) of PreCentral. Have you really moved on?

Just saying....

Let's look at a few facts:
* Look at servers - and Linux is pretty much the OS of choice for computers.
* Most of the TOP 500 supercomputers - Linux
* Most web browsers Linux + Apache
* Google - mostly Linux
* Android runs on a Linux kernel
* There is a fair chance that your router, TV and or DVD player run Linux
* On a desktop - you're right - just a couple % - but slowly rising. Apple (now at 10%) was below 5% in the 90s.

Linux has been declared irrelevant by people like you every year for a couple decades now. And growing all that time - getting on ever more gadgets.

webos might very well die now - but it's not unavoidable. You lost interest - that's fine and even understandable.

But my Pre3 is the best phone available (given my preferences and needs). Even with 0 more apps coming out for it I'll happily use it for the next couple years.

I actually don't have much hope for webos. HP will likely let it die at this point.
But I still would like for a capable and motivated company to take it over.

Oh - and I'm not a Palm faithful. The Pre was my first Palm phone and if - say - Samsung brings out a (for example) Android phone that I like better than Pre3 with webos - I'll get that instead.

I don't understand why you bother to hang around here to tell us to get a phone that we like less?
I could easily have gotten an Iphone 4 if I wanted. I just don't understand why I should settle for that when I can get the (IMHO and for my purposes) better Pre3?

It may be dead, but who are you to show up at a funeral and harrang the mourners? Folk off and move on, if that's what you've done really.

I went into the local Radio Shack store browsed at the many Android versions.. Not sure what to get, so I walked out, holding on to my old Pre. Oh maybe oh maybe Sprint will get a WebOS device in the future.. Can you hear me now?? I don't want to go back to Verizon where they will gouge me on price.

Unfortunately I don't think that report of webos death was an exaggeration.
As far as I know, HP has already laid off 500+/- employees, pretty much everyone involved in TouchPad, & mobile phones HW desighn and manufacturing. Ironically or suspiciously, it happened a day/two before Leo got canned himself.

HP employee store has only some Pixis, Veers and some really old Palm models left, they are even low on accessories now.

I did hear that WebOS software group is still there (the post layoff Pre3 WebOS 2.2.3 update is a proof), but everything else suggests that it's EOL for HP WebOS devices.

IMHO, it was either act of sabotage or pure insanity on the part Leo Apof...er and HP's board.
Good old incompetence cannot cause such an extensive damage even to this long mismanaged company.

I think it's time to say good bye to HP, Palm and my last Pre3. I do not see Meg Whitman as being HP's Steve Jobs, but I wish her the best of luck, after all HP was a synonym of quality and innovation for many years, as long ago as it was.

Selling a Vz Pre3 for $650
pm me if interested.