Did Palm License the iTunes API for Palm Media Sync? 26
One of the lingering questions from yesterday's D7 announcement that the Pre will Sync directly with iTunes via Mac and PC is quite simply this: How did they do that? A close look at the video shows that iTunes appears to think that the Pre is, in fact, an actual iPod - "Syncing iPod" is displayed up there at the top.
John Lech Johansen speculates that Palm does this by basically making a Pre look like an iPod to iTunes:
- When you select “Media Sync” on the Pre, it will switch its USB interface to use Apple’s Vendor Id and the Product Id for a specific iPod model
- The Pre exposes a filesystem through Mass Storage Class that mimics the structure of an iPod
- The Pre responds to Apple’s custom USB command and returns XML info about the device
Both Johansen and our friends at TiPb believe that it will be very easy for Apple to break this functionality if and when they want to through an update to iTunes. So now the question is: is Palm doing this with Apple's good graces or are they doing it on the sly? When the rumor first broke yesterday morning we noted that Apple has licensed the necessary iTunes APIs for other media players, but it seems unlikely that they would do the same for a direct competitor like the Palm Pre.
At D7 yesterday, Rubinstein was very coy:
Kara Swisher of the WSJ asks "Is Apple open to this?" Rubenstein is coy "I can't see why they wouldn't be."
All Things D adds some more color about the exchange:
How is Apple going to feel about that, asks Walt. Rubinstein dodges a bit noting that there are a variety of ways of getting music out of iTunes. Walt pushes back pointing out that this is the first non-Apple device that is recognized as an Apple device by a Mac. Rubinstein dodges again. Seems he’s pretty obviously using his Apple knowledge here. McNamee jumps in. Apple is “practically a monopolist,” he says, adding that people should be able to use music that they purchase in what ever way they see fit.
Media sync feature also works with iPhoto and syncs photos to the Pre. That’s not likely to go over well at Apple either
So the short answer to the question in the title appears to be "No" - which we say despite what seems like a reasonable assumption: that it just takes more chutzpah to publicly reverse engineer an Apple product that we give Palm credit for.
Still, they certainly are talking like they didn't run this by Apple first. That raises all sorts of other questions: Will Apple break this functionality? Will they sue? Does Palm have so many powerful patents to hold over Apple that they're effectively not afraid of Apple's wrath?
26 Comments
I don't use itunes, but I can tell you that I am happy for what they did here.
I hope they are able to keep the functionality but What happens when apple sends out an update and your Pre is bricked?
your pre can't get bricked by iTunes
Yeah stopping the Pre from syncing with iTunes doesn't mean it won't work anymore. It just won't work with iTunes.
If you mean blocked, I don't know whether they could block it because if they are closely mimicking an iPod then iPods might be barred in the process.
This is so crafty and I'm finding the whole Apple revolt relatively humorous. I hope it isn't directly effecting the health of Jobs, some would say he bought it upon himself.
You know it is possible that Palm may have licensed the ability to do this years ago - pre-iphone and pre-pre. They could just be using it now, and would not be doing anything wrong depending on the terms of that agreement. We really have no idea what agreements exist between Apple and Palm, if any, even if there isn't an express agreement may be there is a loophole somewhere. Palm has lawyers, I am sure they looked into this before they went ahead and announced it.
I don't care about iTunes, but if Apple breaks this, it will be obvious and cause a lot of ill will.
This is brinksmanship by Palm, plain and simple. They have nothing to lose.
I think apple would have a hard time trying to say that people dont have the right to control something that they purchased. But if they do sue, palm will just come out with something else to get your music from itunes to the pre.
If they cant directly interface with the software, well go from the back end. And that, apple cant stop.
It seems like Palm, by using a word like "monopolistic" is trying to make Apple/ iTunes look like Microsoft/ Internet Explorer.
Interesting strategy.
True.
Most likely they have the license to do this.
Apple has no reason to reverse this either. They MAKE MONEY on the songs in their store.
So why don't WinMob devices have full-iTunes interoperability?
Microsoft doesn't need to use iTunes. They have their own solutions with Windows Media Player.
Or maybe they're going to rely on anti-trust law which is where McNamee's "monopoly" comment came from.
For you oldies out there, IBM had a mainframe called the 360 40 or so years ago. IBM made a lot of money selling peripherals like disk drives and printers. Then someone tried to horn in on the business by reverse engineering the interfaces and selling compatible disk drives and printers. IBM tried to change their interfaces to lock out the competition. But they got hauled into court by the Feds. Government ended up saying, uh-uh, no changing interfaces to avoid competition. And computer hardware has been interchangeable ever since.
This might be the silver-lining for medium-size businesses with Obama/Democrats in the White House.
it's interesting that McNamee says that apple is
They just keep coming out with silver bullets. The perfect Achilles heel.
It would be fairly easy with a USB protocol analyzer to grab the descriptors that an iPod uses to enumerate itself, and then to make the Pre present the same descriptors when it's plugged it making it look just like an iPod to the PC. From a legal perspective, one of the descriptors is a vendor ID (VID), which you have to purchase/license from the USB Implementor's Forum. If Palm is using Apple's VID, then there might be a legal issue there; at a minimum Apple could make a stink to the USBIF requesting that Palm's VID be revoked for violating their agreement with the USBIF. If Palm is not using Apple's VID, the it would be pretty simple for Apple to patch their iTunes software to lock out the Pre.
It's going to be interesting to see how this plays out...
Just dont update itunes.
Now THIS is good stuff!
If some of this scuttle is true, how ironic will it be for Apple to get a taste of the kind of negative PR it's been dishing at MS for years?
I have a question... Will the pre be able to sync with multiple Itunes' account?
If this is licensed from Apple, then that's great. It pushes the iTunes ecosystem for them and gives Palm am established client with which to sync.
If it's hacked, that's a problem for everyone, *especially* users.
When you license it, you get the keys but also typically an agreement that the licensor will ensure compatibility going forward. So, if Apple has to change iTunes for legitimate reasons (fix a bug, add functionality, overhaul protocols, etc.) they'll work with Palm to make it transparent to end uses.
If it's a hack, then it becomes the same as iPhone jailbreakers and iTunes. Sometimes Apple deliberately changes iTunes to discourage jailbreaking, but just as often bugs (DFU mode on Mac) or non-targeted changes suddenly stop hacked devices from working.
With jailbreakers, they know the problems they could face and decided for themselves -- adults take responsibility.
If Palm has hacked iTunes, their average users might not even know it, and if iTunes stops working, they'll be pi$$ed and -- will likely blame Apple. Heck, even if they can't sync their iTunes movie rental they might just blame Apple. If they can't sync their old iPhone apps, they might just blame Apple. And the fault for all 3 will rest squarely on Palm.
Apple iTunes/iPhone are no more a monopoly than Nintendo or Xbox -- devices are different than computers. Sony hacking into Xbox live or trying to make unlicensed connections to the Wii are better parallels. If courts decide otherwise, Apple might be forced to license iTunes to one and all, but it will still be *licensed*.
In the mean time, if Palm isn't licensed, it's bad for Apple, bad for users, and ultimately bad for Palm.
Jon Rubinstein is the father of iPod, and no one knows iTunes/iPod than he does, so I'm sure he knows what he is doing.
Like some of you said already, this is a win-win situation for both Apple and Palm. Palm has better ecosystem in the media aspect, and Apple can sell more DRM-free music (isn't it what non-protected media all about?).
So just relax, everyone.
Don't forget the Pre's over-the-air updates. If Apple patches itunes to block the Pre, what stops Palm from pushing their own patches to your Pre to combat Apple's patch soon after? :D Of course, if Apple's patch made itunes reach out and wipe your Pre... well that would suck...
Hmmm. Apple's quiet. Too quiet.