HP CTO Phil McKinney sits down with Ben and Dion 68
We already noted HP CTO Phil McKinney's welcome to the webOS community, but as promised McKinney has updated the post with a link to the above discussion with two guys that Palm fans know well, Ben Galbraith and Dion Almaer.
The three chat about McKinney's place in HP, HP's interest in Palm, and more. Oh, the chuckles about smartphones being a "sideshow:" "Our interest is in the phone business, no if, ands, buts about it."
McKinney also mentions slates and "other form factors," which could be taken as yet another hint at webOS netbooks. We also like the talk about HP's scale and how they intend to put that behind webOS - in particular their strength outside the US. On slates: "We think webOS on a slate could be an amazing kind of experience."
Get this: HP has an event called TechCon and McKinney offered free phones to HP engineers who build webOS apps (many of which our readers have already seen begin to pop up in the Beta feeds).
Last but not least, here's the brief synopsis of what is going to happen to Palm as a business unit: "Palm will become the seat of innovation for global mobile platforms. Our intent is to leave Palm as is. [...] Don't mangle up Palm kind of philsophy." Palm will be an "autonomous unit" within HP but able to take advantage of the resources at HP.
68 Comments
can I get a free phone? Webos tablets hoot hoot!
Ok I am stupidly excited after seeing this video! Could things get any better for Palm and WebOS?? I dream of owning a webos slate. And I swear my Pre has even been running better since the merger. (It's happy) lol
Go McKinney, Go Sprint, Go Palm!
Take on the pirate mentality, open up the capabilies and value and break down the stiff stodgy world of ATT/VZ and apple. Set the trends, get data intesive, BREAK THE RULES!
The news just keeps getting better and better, doesn't it?
That last paragraph made me smile. That's exactly what I was hoping for.
+1 best news about the hp deal so far. Palm will live long and thrive. Exciting! Wooho!
YES! We can finally get past all the doomCasting!
Today is a great day in webOS land!
THAT was a incredible interview, and put many, MANY issues to rest.
Thanks!
all this joy is making me sooo happy!!! this partnership is wonderful...I can't wait for all the apps and the new technology. great job gentlemen!
all this joy is making me sooo happy!!! this partnership is wonderful...I can't wait for all the apps and the new technology. great job gentlemen!
Wow. It would be heaven if they annouce a new device in the next few weeks.
Awesome!
The rumors are laid to rest. He couldn't have said anything more encouraging (other than an actual new product announcement, of course).
Is there a chance we'll see precentral change to weboscentral with HP coming out saying we'll see slates and netbooks running webOS?
They should really look into getting some clip-on microphones for doing this around-the-table videos, the volume levels aren't great :(
Sounded like they had good mics, but died during the recording.
This dude gets Palm! so excited about the slates and a new phone!
Much patience seems to be paying off. Very exciting to not have jumped ship. Greatly anticipating what lies ahead.
Hey Dieter
Thanks a lot for this great news.
That's almost more than one would have dreamed of.
Me being an engineer, I have always owned / used the HP RPN (Reverse Polish Notation) calculators.
Those are just great. I was always an admirer of HP.
So as the Palm Loyalist I am, seeing now Palm and HP getting together in such a great way:
That just makes me HAPPY ! :-)
Greetings from Switzerland
hey what kind of engineer are you I'm think about goin to school for that in sept. I have always used hp computers since 1999 I had a hp envy 15 but I sent it back when I heard that the 14 was coming out.
I'm happy to here something good finally I jus feel a new device being leaked really soon.
yes!!!! Now that's what I'm talking about!
now Palm has HPs marketing, resources, support and financial backing to really shake some things up again like they used to when Palm introduced PDA cellular devices to the world.. They were the pioneers to the smartphone seeing as Apple dropped the ball with Newton.. It's nice to see the legacy may go on...
Interesting. This is Day 1, so the realities are seriously subject to change. But, from the angle he's pitching, it almost sounds like "Palm" will develop a lot of the new products we've heard about, rather than being the software wing for HP hardware. If that is the case, should be interesting to watch.
All this really didn't really seem unexpected. We know HP was serious about it, they drop $1.2B after all. The problem is it's all talk, and no show.
However, now that the buy out is complete, I'm guessing we'll finally hear something by the end of the month. all this app promotion needs something to keep rolling.. what better way than to have more devices to use those apps.
especially since pdk = more games. And the original Pre is hurting, I can't play jump o'clock without rebooting my phone =(
Do yourself a favor and upgrade to the latest Uberkernel/Govnah, and enable the Compache kernel. Its that good, and it drastically reduced the occurence of TMC error
Yes, yes, yes. Uberkernel/Govnah, with 32 mb of comp cache, even running at stock speed makes all the difference in the world. With overclocking, it is even better with the exception of battery life.
i'm done w/ patching, I don't want to have to deal with it when there's a major OS update. and that doesn't help palm. I want them to announce something so they don't completely wither away from the public's eye. I want HP to succeed in revitalizing Palm. But we all know time is always of the essence, and Palm has been short on it from the start.
FYI...all patches and stable kernels installed through preware are OTA update compatible. The phone will update and the patches will sit as placeholders until the patch is updated for the new OS version. Then you simply need to update them. No uninstalling and reinstalling. Takes all of 5 mins or less. The kernels take care of the TMC errors almost completely, speed up your pre so it is actually as smooth as you want it to be, and make you feel like you're using a brand new phone.
Yes, new hardware would be nice (I'm dying for it myself). Yes, the phone should've had many of the options that patches give us from the beginning. But with the latest developments in patches and Uberkernel/Govnah, thanks in large part to rwhitby, unixpsycho, and oil, you really have no excuse to continue to complain about the same old issues when a fix is there. Take advantage of your community and the hard and brilliant work many members have done to improve your phone. You won't be disappointed.
This is heading off topic, but I thought kernels needed to be removed before updates. But ... Love Govnah & kernel replacements - TMC go away & my Pre is much faster!
Per Rod, they should be OTA safe. However, if you want to you can remove it and see how other phone react to the update. Either way, I'd say that the work these guys are doing is incredible and has breathed life into many pre owners' phones and attitudes about waiting for another device.
my complaints are not only for myself, but as an end user in general. the user should not have to do all those things, they want it to just work. or have some kind of confidence that palm is going to do something about it.
now, this buy out complicates that because no doubt they could not talk much, and needed to solidify tons of details before announcing something they could produce. but HP/Palm needs to capitalize on this whole HotApps promo as much as they can.
most of the patching and stuff I avoid is also due to not wanting to jump through hoops. Last time I had to dig out the drivers from the latest WebOSdoc jar file in order to get them installed so my Pre would be seen by quick install. and I had to dig out the link for webosdoc from JS files because none of the direct links worked online.
In response to linh.nguyen, I found it very interesting what Phil Mckinney had to say in regards to innovation. linh.nguyen was complaining about patching. Others have had the same complaint and it's a valid point. But now I understand the other perspective.
Some people take homebrew as nearly personally as abortion. Its an option, not a requirement. Patches helped take some of the rough edges off WebOS, and are valueable until adopted or otherwise improved. I think the biggest concern, it the impact of OTA updates. So, it becomes a mixed blessing to have a phone that is both so easily modified and has an o/s that is dynamic and growing. It could be a lot more complicated, but the tools we've been blessed with, make it very appetizing if you don't love the OEM form. Its nice to have options.
Seriously excited! The next year shall be EPIC! iOS? iPhone? What's that?!
H/Palm: Bring it! :D
The video doesn't play on webOS?!
I've considered myself a Palm Fan since my Palm Vx and I visit p|c almost daily (I even knew how to type p|c) but I didn't know Ben and Dion. Maybe you should say "that Palm Developers know well."
The most interesting comment:
ALL cellphone carriers (Verizon, AT&T, T-Mobile, Sprint, etc) license HP technology to run their networks!
That gives HP not only a good relationship with them but also a good negotiating chip and makes it more likely that they can make devices work well with the networks.
And there is my point. HP caters to Corporate america. Corporate america NEEDS webOS. HP wants to pimp webOS to everyone who uses their other hardware. So why would they want to spend time creating phones when everyone else does. Shucks.. go ahead and keep your hardware... but HP will having these companies begging to use WebOS since now it will be the only thing that is compatible with these DataWarehouses.... I think HP is smart
After watching that, it make me want to go back to EDS/HP to write apps for them and their data centers.
Jobs just pooped himself.
Maybe not completely, but I'm sure he had a "wet" fart.
I don't consider waiting till the smoke settles as Jumping Ship...what do you gain in waiting? At least those who chose to migrate to Android but still liked Palm have the benefit of knowing what REALLY works well. Sure.. you can say "Loyalty" is the benefit, but does PALM care about you? I think it will be a very nice thing for Palm to get another phone.. and I would imagine it will be close to the end of the year before it comes out. Add to that the 4 or 5 months to get the bugs and OTA updates worked out... BOOM... I'm eligible for another phone.. maybe a PALM, but hopefully they'll be lightyears ahead of Apple and Android with this next device instead of playing catch up again.
P.S. Don't be surprised if in the interests of corporate immorality, you don't see HP somehow in the same bed with Google/Android in some technological form. I mean to dismiss the notion is pollyana at best.
I listened to the interview... But how long was it in SW episode I that we realized senator Palpatine was really the Sith Lord Emperor. Had the republic (Android) and the Jedi's (PALM) fighting for some hidden Agenda.
Take what you hear with a grain of salt and keep your eyes OPEN!!
WebOS may very well be on an HTC, Motorola, Samsung, Phone. Perhaps HP wants to be the next Android?
I would be cool with that. I love webos. If they place webos on another device, I'd be happy with that also.
""Palm will become the seat of innovation for global mobile platforms. Our intent is to leave Palm as is. [...] Don't mangle up Palm kind of philsophy." Palm will be an "autonomous unit" within HP but able to take advantage of the resources at HP.
Here is where this is going.. maybe not on the iPhone, but HPWebOS will be the next Android:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qFY7ysQjsQI
I was just curious what kind of "deep pockets" we're dealing with here, and let me just say, I'm impressed: http://money.cnn.com/magazines/fortune/fortune500/2010/full_list/.
That "IS" impressive Top 10 Fortune 500.
Software is great guys but you'll never get anywhere if you don't address build quality.
now hp has a good mobile os that has a linux base and they have had equipment in the telecommunications infrastructure for a while now I can hardly imagine the depth at which this could impact our mobile experience if they combine the 2
The only way this would be better is if HP came out and hired the WebOS Internals team.
The BIG question went unanswered (and unasked): How is HP/Palm going to convince major name-brand app developers to develop apps for a phone that has such small market share? To take an example from the world of media apps: the Washington Post and Slate unveiled their iPhone apps, but there's no Palm app in site; Android and then Blackberry will be next on their list. And the absence of major apps for Palm will keep people buying iPhones, Androids, and Blackberries. If HP wants to get major apps on WebOS, it's going to have to convince the world that market share is going to grow. The way to do that would be to license WebOS to at least one major handset manufacturer, which would then loudly promise to have X number of WebOS handset models out within some specified timeframe--and HP, meanwhile, could announce that it would have Y number of models out within some specified timeframe. It's too late for Palm to follow the Apple model--i.e. not license the OS. Either it will follow the Windows model, and license the OS, or it will die.
BIG QUESTION? What?
Compare the air here in this interview to the air, say three months ago, before the buyout. THERE'S NO COMPARISON!!!
Palm gets extra lives. HP is already courting developers. The Palm engineers are working on new SDK and more importantly, PDK, which will give all developers the power to easily port many already programmed iphone apps to webOS.
Finally, get new devices out (which is happening obviously) and the Palm/HP slate running webOS and the tech world is going to take notice. Palm is back, new apps are likely to increase rather dramatically and we all get our webOS fix for the foreseeable future!
This interview was GREAT!
I agree that the interview was great, mjrei--the guy was very smart and appealing. I'm just saying that at this point in the cell phone wars you have to do more than get small-scale entrepreneurial developers motivated via small financial incentives and an attractive technical environment (though these things do help). You've got to get the developers of big, well-financed apps incentivized to create a WebOS version along with the iPhone, Android, and Blackberry versions. Right now they're not doing it, and nothing in this interview is going to change that. And if that doesn't change, WebOS won't be one of the two or three or four survivors of the cell phone wars. Hence my suggestion, above, that HP, amid much fanfare, license WebOS to at least one major handset manufacturer.
What do you hope to accomplish by licensing WebOS out? It's not going to increase market share Why would HTC pay money to use WebOS when they already get Android for free?
HP can still be very successful in the smartphone wars with a small number of handset types all produced by HP. Just look at Apple, one handset, one manufacturer, no fracturing of the OS. HP had revenue of $30.8 billion in Q4 09 (which was down 8% from 2008), HTC's full 2009 revenue was $4.5b and Apple's 2009 Q4 earnings of $1.57b was their most profitable quarter EVER! HP has the resources to produce hardware and encourage developers on level that you can bet has other handset manufacturers very, very concernednow that HP has a solid (or beter depending on your opinion) OS to work with.
You're right in that apps are a huge factor in sales, but there are two aspects to that, quality and quantity. While it shouldn't be the case, quantity IS the bigger factor because people assume quantity means quality. Most of these apps, CNN, facebook, linkedin, etc (as examples) do very little, if anything, more than the mobile websites for these companies, so pushing for apps from them isn't exactly addressing the quality issue. Apple says "There's an app for that" but the truth is, most of the time you don't need an app for that, just a bookmark. The work HPalm is doing to encourage small devs is the best way to address the quantity issue because you can throw a small amount of money at a large audience and make a large gain (numbers wise).
The quality apps that are needed are productivity tools like Docs2Go and more games. The most downloaded paid apps for the iPhone fall into two categories, stupid garbage and games. Stupid garbage happens on it's own, games need to be encouraged along with professional productivity stuff... And licensing out WebOS is not going to help that.
The point of licensing the OS wouldn't be to make money from the licensing, brendilon. The point would be to create the expectation that lots of WebOS handsets are coming online, and thereby spur the creation of apps. It's a chicken and egg thing: the expectation of lots of handsets, from multiple manufacturers, drives the creation of apps, and the proliferation of apps then gets people to buy the handsets when they come out (which sustains the creation of apps, etc.). Right now WebOS is stuck in a vicious circle: Nobody will buy a Palm phone because of the lack of apps (relative to iPhone and Android), and most of the major app developers won't develop for WebOS because nobody's buying the phone. HP has to break that cycle.
Patience is always good for Karma...maybe HP is doing something different this time around. If so they bought a big 1 Billion $ lab....
They sure have noticed by now that built quality is important.
One of the reasons why palm didn't do so well at first with the pr
I'd say the several weeks wait that many would-be Pre owners were cited on Sprint release day was as big or a bigger factor than build quality. The BQ complaints I've seen really aren't that unusual compared to any other first gen phone. The original iPhone had batery overheating problems as well as glass cracking. The new iPhone drops calls if you talk on it on your left ear!
Build quality is an issue, but much, much smaller than not being able to meet initial demand. A lot of people left the Sprint stores with other phones for that reason.
My previous comment sounded unintentionally negative. Sorry about that.
I think this is all great news. Think of the thousands of engineers who will eventually be getting webOS phones as their company phone. When they want a function for their phone, some will build it themselves, and others will ask colleagues, or HP itself to build those apps.
I expect HP is trying to get the apps, PIM, and document editing apps ready now so they can start supplying webOS phones instead of buying Blackberries, Android or iOS phones phones for employees.
I'm sure he knows the entire development schedule, too bad he can't reveal it.
Oh, I forgot: HP is a million dollar advertising client for all the major networks. I expect any apps from them to come out on webOS also. Same with newspapers and magazines. They are not going to ignore the OS of one of their biggest ad revenue clients.
I just got an e-mail blast from the HP VP and GM, Solution Partners Organization, Stephen DiFranco and he states officially that HP's priorities are:
HP will become a leader in smartphones, through our global scale and financial resources, coupled with the exceptional Palm webOS mobile operating system.
HP will leverage webOS into a wide range of connected mobile devices, from smartphones to slates to netbooks.
With one billion people around the world using HP technology everyday across more than 170 countries, HP will continue to invest to deliver differentiated, compelling user experiences for audiences ranging from individual consumers to enterprise businesses; and we
i don't understand all the hoopla about confirming devices... i thought they were pretty clear they wanted to do that from the start.
Until today everything I read was just speculation. There have been a lot of people leaving WebOS / Palm due to the fact that there was no clear roadmap. What this confirmation means to me is that it is now worth waiting awhile to see what they come up with rather than pulling the trigger now and going to Android.
speculation? HP had a conference call laying out they wanted to expand out webOS, it was pretty clear they didn't want to try and reinvent the wheel with palm's patent portfolio
That video was awesome, from a "what HP is doing with Palm" perspective. I think it's clear they plan to take on RIM in the corporate arena and Apple in the consumer one. They are already letting lose and posting Palm all over the place, and writing apps in house with thousands of Engineers fighting for a free Palm phone.
It's clear this guy is evangelizing Palm through HP, and it's hard to state just how important it is for things to happen like this. Palm remaining itself but having the financial and technical muscle of HP is what we were hoping for, and it clearly seems to be what we are going to get. Doubling down on WebOS seems to be an understatement.
Can't wait to see the next phones and all the interconnecting apps. I mean, they are writing in-house apps for their data center, which will likely get turned around and marketed to customers who are running HP's data center apps and equipment. Getting this kind of buy in, already, is huge.
I just received this email with the subject heading "Big News From Palm".
You can now purchase Palm webOS phones with or without activation right from HP Wireless Central.
http://www.cellstores.com/mobile/?sssdmh=dm13.252174&r=hp
I'm extremely excited about the news presented in this video! We have previously just had speculation and rumor, and now HP has confirmed everything that many in this community hoped for. This is particularly important to me because my Palm Pre just broke three days after the one year warranty ended, and while I have a free phone upgrade as a Sprint Premier customer, I do not want to use it yet. I am also extremely happy with my Pre, so I am going through a number of hoops to get my Pre repaired out of warranty rather than switching to something else (my CC automatically doubles my warranty). Here's hoping for new phones very soon.
http://bit.ly/cWRMq4
that one ends in about 8 hours, has 0 bids and starts at $149.99. not too bad, really.
i have been seeing some o2 ads for palm on TV in the UK, before HP's aquisition of Palm you hardly saw any ads. This video was great it highlights all the concerns webos fans been having. I just hope now that palm has access to Hp's billions, the next phone that comes out is A* quality, something in par with the iphone 4 or the HTC Evo.
And Phil has had a go at writing a webOS application himself too.
This is super exciting. I can't wait for all the great things to come for webOS!