Pre 2 and webOS 2.0 'round the globe round-up | webOS Nation
 
 

Pre 2 and webOS 2.0 'round the globe round-up 62

by Derek Kessler Thu, 21 Oct 2010 2:28 pm EDT

Palm Pre 2 vs. the original Pre

So there’s plenty of uproar in the United States about the Pre 2 not looking like a possibility for Sprint, but what of the rest of the world? It’s not looking exceedingly good there either.

Both Vodafone Germany and O2 Germany have come out to say that they have no plans to offer the Pre 2 to their customers. The German carriers are uncharacteristically communicative with customers over Twitter, at least in comparison to their international brethren.

Most other carriers have maintained a stony wall of silence, or in the case of Sprint responded with a company line email to all inquiries noting that they don’t have plans to offer the Pre 2 to customers, who could just buy an original and aging Pre if they wanted one. Problem is, we’re fairly certain that 99% of those barraging Sprint on Facebook and via email (you can stop forwarding us their company line replies) already have a Pre and were miffed when they couldn’t get the Pre Plus, let alone the markedly better Pre 2.

There is at least one bright spot in this strange Pre 2 launch mess: webOS 2.0 will get to everybody, at some point in, you guessed it, the “coming months.” If "coming months" ends up being as short as we hope, then it might not be so long of a wait.

Of course, the question we’re all trying to answer is “why don’t any carriers want to sell me a Pre 2?” There are a couple of possible answers, and they’re wrapped up in the mystery of carrier-manufacturer contracts. It’s possible no carriers want to invest in training and advertising to sell the Pre 2 because of their lackluster experience selling the phones’ predecessors, or maybe they’re holding off for something more impressive, maybe something we’ll get to see at CES this year. Or maybe nobody told them.

Source: Palm UK (Facebook), Palm France (Facebook), O2 Germany (Twitter), Vodafone Germany (Facebook); via: Golem.de, webOSroundup, webOS Blog.de; Thanks to everybody that sent all of this in!

62 Comments

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This is depressing.

Let's sit back and see how many more people leave Sprint for Verizon. I will definitely be one of them. However I will not leave Sprint for Verizon just to get the Pre 2 but I will leave for the iPhone. If for some reason the HP super device hits before the iPhone arrives on Verizon then I will most likely go with HP. Sprint better hope they get an HP super device before Verizon gets the iPhone because that is the only way I will stay with Sprint.......Android and Windows can kick rocks!

I love webOS, but not enough to pay $20 a month more to Verizon to get a warmed over Pre.

Hopefully 2.0 is good enough to make me willing to hold on to my Pre and give HPalm time to introduce a phone that's competitive screen wise with the phones people are actually buying. If not I will suck it up and switch over to an EVO or Epic.

Palm really is horrible on execution. They really just missed an opportunity to release the next generation of software with new and exciting hardware. Yet, they released it with an aging pre design. They better release some new phones with webOS 2.5 or 3 come january because they just ruined the webOS 2.0 release.

Not to mention, come January, Palm is going to have to compete with the iPhone on Verizon and Windows 7 every where else.

I honestly don't see what's "aging" about the Pre design. It needs a slightly bigger screen, ok. But even if palm built a "brick in your pocket" phone like the Evo, how many people would still not go get an apple or android device now-a-says anyway? Its all about mindshare which apple and google have on lock. The vertical slider has a space. BB feels the same way with the torch. Some people want a compact smart phone (OMG could it be true?) The pre is a niche product and I'm ok with that.

If you people want an evo go get one already.

I don't want an EVO. What I was referring to is the re-release of the same phone. They got away with releasing the pre plus, which I have, but then re-releasing the original pre again??? And I agree with you, if they would have just made the screen slightly bigger I wouldn't really have complained. But honestly, this was a silly move. They should have released the phone with a couple of more phones together, not stand alone.

It worked for Apple.

Though this might come as a bit of a shock to some, Palm is not Apple.

What DOESN'T work for Apple? They started their comeback by repackaging their same old stale Mac in cases that featured clear plastic with green or orange plastic trim, and sold a million of them. Apple could release the iTurd and sell a million of them before any of their faithful bothered to ask what it was for.

You are right, it DID work for Apple. That is why they have keep the same size and similar shape since 2007. On the other hand the Pre DID NOT work for Palm. Therefore you don't keep trying to capitalize on failure. Instead you make improvements and then release #2. I think if they could have keep the same phone shape but increased the screen size to 3.4 or 3.5, that would have been plenty of room for screen size and to increase the keyboard a bit. Still 3.5 is a hell of a long way away from 4.3 with the EVO. So I don't think you would be calling a 3.5 inch Pre 2 a brick. Of course lets just say that the Pre 2 is the phone that Palm had already been working on before HP came along. Wouldn't somebody have realized that the first Pre was not a big enough success to try and identically copy for future models?

It may be that the other carriers were waiting to see if Palm went belly up before HP bought them.

This is a NIGHTMARE!!!!!!!!! Sprint, WHERE IS MY PRE 2???????????

wow hpalm really sucks at everything aside from webos itself... They're basically saying buy an epic on sprint. Also,why the heck would they release a new phone on Verizon of all carriers? They have droid fever, AND the iphone is releasing soon also? How the F*** is palm going to compete with apple advertising?!?!

we need a new super WebOS device on Sprint NOW!

I don't understand "lackluster" sales of the Pre. Exactly how many sprint phones have sold more than the Pre other than the obvious EVO? I'm sure BBs combined yeah, but any single device?

This seems to be a "oh the Pre was supposed to save our company" spitefulness to me.

expectations and results were way off fine, but honestly, as small of a company Palm was, did it really need 20% market share to survive? Do we really need to sell 1 million phones a month?

This is just stock market world "what defines success" bs.

Idiot, no market share = no developers = no apps.

It doesn't seem like webOS 2.0 is out running the doom and gloom. While I think the Pre2 will be a good phone and will be the best webOS phone when it comes out that doesn't really say much as it's hard to impress a public and the press with just spec bumps (even if they aren't anything to sneeze at). I have tried to remain possitive but it is difficult. I think they would have been better off holding off on releasing webOS 2.0 and the Pre2 until it could be released together with some with a little more.

Stop worrying about that!

99% that it is be the following:

1) the Pre2 is coming too late, they know that and just want to sell it to get it out of stock and have at least a little success to the development-work (and fullfill their obligations with manufacturers)

2) therefore they sell it on "some" carriers. don't think they even asked all the other carriers to bring it - this is GOOD for you as you would really be angry if you buyed a Pre2 and they bring a super-device a few months after

3) mainly, it isn't a carrier-phone but will become a developer phone.

4) they will show a lot of great "super"-devices next year and bring them worldwide


That's it, so don't worry...

Palm sold it's carriers and their customers a PHONE which does not find the PHONE numbers for all your contacts synced with MS outlook. I've been a huge Treo fan for years, especially the 50 some programs I have purchased, but it always worked as a PHONE! The fact that it might be the most elegant operating system is meaningless.

This is no different than Detroit building consistently unreliable cars and then wondering my Father buys his first Honda and never buys another Chevy. At some point, spin & hype only causes self-delusion.

I think what was said above is what they are doing. This refresher device is just to really showcase webos2.0, and is offered to only some carriers. A device that was already developed by Palm, and was never meant to be revolutionary. I do think they should make a sprint, AT&T and Tmobile Version and only offer it through HP, if people are interested in getting this new version. This way it would atleast let people, if interested in this refreshed device a chance to get it. Also offer a deal with companys for oncontract prices if the other carriers allow it, otherwise just put up the for sale sign on HP website, have acouple of thousand available for every carrier (US and domestic) and call it a day, until they release the super devices next year.

What seemed like a soft launch now seems more like a vapor-launch. Obviously, most carriers are somewhat skeptical about this platform given the flood of new smartphones hitting this Fall and Winter. If HP is testing the waters with the Pre 2 then they are finding them frigid.

The future of the Pre might depend on how well the SFR launch in France goes.

I don't think France is thinking about phones right now, they are too busy striking and rioting in the streets about working until 62.

Sooo... we Sprint faithful get shafted on the Plus and are told to just wait with joyful hope for the coming of the Pre 2... then we're shafted on that and are told to wait till C.E.S. for the SUPER phone. What if we're shafted then too?

Then it's time to look for a phone that will elegantly accept the inducting charger so that I can continue to use my touchstones. it might seem stupid, but that is one of the things causing me to hang in there.

I'm personally very happy with my overclocked pre minus. It's quik and I have a spare battery so that isn't an issue really. I want to wait till the super device comes out even tho I'm due for an upgrade. My wife got ann evo when I just came out. She plays with my phone just as much and wants a palm now. She don't even use the ''4g'' and even when she does my palm is normally quicker on the web(i also have the patch installed that speeds up the internet). So those of you switching just because you didn't get the pre 2 should think again. Good and better things are coming. Be patient. Webos is where you want to be :)

That's "Right said Fred!"

I'm concerned.

Us Sprint Pre people will be getting our NEW HP Hardware Webos phones in Feb. after the CES show. HP is planning on all new hardware for the loyal Sprint following, big screens, folding landscape, and touchscreen only devices.

Palm Pre 2 is just a stop gap that Palm already had in the plans before they were bought by HP, it just took a little longer to get out because of the buy out.

So holding out for better hardware on Sprint Palm Pre HD, also we will be getting a Sprint HP Tablet run on 4G WiMax along the CES, the next HP phone will be 4G and run either WiMax and LTE or Both.

This is pretty much what I was thinking. This phone was probably originally targeted for an earlier release. The reason Sprint, etc, are not jumping on board is because they are all pushing their new high-end smartphones to be 4G (instead of just 4, like Apple). There are no doubt WebOS 4G phones deep in development (WiMax and LTE). It doesn't make sense to do a big push to get their customers onto their non-premium data plans. The current form factor may not support the battery size needed to give adequate 4G battery-life, so something somewhat bigger, but not as big as the EVO mini-tablet.

This is exactly what I thought when I first heard about this Pre 2. My wife has an EVO... While I think it's a pretty good (only pretty good mind you), a WebOS phone with 4G with the features you mentioned would make perfect sense for an upgrade from the Pre.

I'm not sure exactly where the Pre 2 fits into HPs plans... I'm not sure it will do too well... Anyone who wanted a Pre probably already has one... I'm not sure how this will draw new people to the OS, and that's what concerns me.

However, I think if they can get a "super" Pre out by the beginning of the year (or better yet, by Christmas), HPalm will be doing well to get back in the game.

I don't care about carrier launches, I just want to be able to buy the hardware! Cut out the middle man, let any gadget store in the world sell the phone and generate some cash and, most importantly, some app buyers.

As I've said before, I have no clue why Palm/HP is incapable of acting like a global player when the mobile market is global, instead of like a local US company with "overseas" attempts. To compete in the mobile market against global players like iOS, Android, RIM etc. you are doomed if you restrict yourself to focusing just on one market. In the world outside of the US people tend to buy a phone they like and choose a carrier with a suitable plan. Of course the carrier can try to sweeten the deal by subsidizing a phone but you can get the same phone with any carrier.

Anyway, it's a pity that only SFR seems to be selling the phone in Europe instead of any gadget store throughout the 500 million people European market. But as carriers in France have to unlock their phones when the contract ends and the SFR preposted page said you could by it off contract I'll just order it from France and pop my Swedish SIM-card in. Just have to live with the keys saying AZERTY instead of QWERTZ..

I agree - we really need to divorce the hardware and the carrier in the US. If I want a Pre, I should be able to buy it and put it on the network of my choice. I know it's far more complicated than buying a computer and putting it on your ISP at home, but I'm tired of seeing hardware I like go to carrier A, then the next gen to carrier B, etc. I am not carrier loyal but in this case mobile device loyal, and this integration of hardware and carrier companies is too tight.

A carrier provides a signal and a voice and data connection. Beyond that (and their coverage areas), I don't care about them.

A hardware maker provides a device I interact act with all day long, and software for my needs. Changing that affects me far more than a carrier.

I'm assuming Sprint will get some webOS devices next year and give Sprint users something, but what if Sprint only picks up slab devices and I want a physical keyboard? Even though HPalm makes it, I can't get it - and I'm stuck with my carrier unless I pay ETF or wait until my two years is up.

I hate to say this, but why do webOS users piss and moan so much?? I don't just want to say go try another platform, but damnit, "GO TRY ANOTHER PLATFORM!" Otherwise shutup and realize that the underdog is the underdog for a reason!!! And, most of the time the underdog does not win! That's movie shit when they do! IF you can't wait for an HP superphone, buy Android or Windows! Either way, HP is going to drop another phone sometime after CES, and I'm willing to bet it will be quite the device. The way i see it, buy your Evos and Epics on Amazon or Ebay. Don't waste your upgrade. Then, when HP drops our new baby, then come on back home!

But PLEASE STOP THIS WHINING! OMG! You'd think that all your lives revolve around your damn cell phones! If your Pre is breaking, buy another on Amazon, or utilize your insurance. But, please shut up! Many of you seem to think that just because you didn't buy an Iphone or an Android phone that somehow you don't have a herd mentality, but that's exactly what you have if you are bellyaching because you can't follow the herd!!!!!! We bought niche phones form underdogs! RECOGNIZE AND LIVE ACCORDINGLY! We are still underdogs, despite having new owners!!!!

Goosfraba

My sentiments exactly. I'm pretty new and have the Pre Minus. I've been very happy with the phone. The browser is light years better than my Blackberry Bold 9650. The performance has also been better with the Blackberry exhibiting lag for no obvious reason in the middle of very simple actions. It also makes the Pre's boot time seem like the blink of an eye. The Blackberry's battery life is also no better, if not worse than my Pre's. My wife dropped hers less than 3 days after we took it out of the box, and it survived with no cracks. I don't need 100,000 apps. I need about 5 or 6, and I've been able to find what I need in the App Catalog. I've only gotten Too Many Cards, once, and that was with the unbelievably heavy ESPN mobile website. I've been there other times with no problems, too. It also boots about 3 times faster than my WinXP desktop.

My wife dropped her Pre again, this time on tile, and STILL no cracks. And to think, I almost didn't get the insurance on her phone because I figured she knew how to take care of a phone.

Biggest fans are usually the toughest critics as well.

Well maybe except for iPhans because they always follow the almighty order of Lord Jobs.

The beginning of the end of mankind.....

I was thinking more along the lines of:

"The beginning of the end of America..."

But I guess the rest of the world might not be TOO far off.

Why would any carrier want to sell a rebranded phone that didnt sell well to begin with whats next slaping a diffrent houseing on it and calling it by some other name

I just wish HP would flex some muscle couple with common sense - and give us something to keep us focused on webOS. Send us a sign...Maybe it can say something like - "To all those webOS diehard faithfuls - Have Faith - Your reward shall be forthcoming! Better Days Ahead!"

They don't have to reveal specs, dates, roadmaps, etc. Just a sign that better things are ahead.....In the absence of communication - people assume the worst.

They are keeping quiet because they need to sell the phones that they just released. Imagine how many people (not that there isn't a ton already) that will pass up the Pre 2 because something new is just around the corner. No one wants to be stuck with something for a year or longer when they KNOW something new is just around the corner.

well i work for o2 in the uk and i love my palm pre i can catagoracly say that i hope o2 will support the new pre2... There are good signals as pre plus has sold very well.
bring on web os 2.0

It's just like Olivia Munn on G4 said about smartphones: 'whichever UI you learn, you like.' We see the benefits of WebOS and we know the UI, so we dig it.

But with this news, we'll have to ask ourselves: 'which is more important: having a more powerful smartphone NOW, or waiting for the next WebOS device?'

Is your upgrade itch just too much to bear? Or does your love of WebOS outweigh the painful, burning, cracking, not-unlike-jock-itch affliction of phone envy?

mmmmmm...... Olivia Munn

I'm surprised about O2 Germany. Didn't they said the Pre was actually selling well for them?

i'm not surprised, they (and vodafone) gonna start selling the iphone4 soon. In comparison, the hardware specs of the pre2 look as outdated as the are.

a contract lasts 2 years, so all people already owning a pre have at least 1 year (pre plus owners 1.5 years) left on their contract and there is plenty of time to wait for a real good webOS device, coming first half next year.
the Pre2 itself really looks like it is just not good enough to convince people to buy it over a phone from the dark android/iOS side.

Realistically what is missing in palm pre? Software or hardware? Everyone says they love the OS and multitasking and notifications but would not recommend pre to friends and families due to hardware issues.

If Palm makes hardware just close to iphone-4 and Droid X or Droid Global, no one is going to buy palm. Only people who would buy it will be people who had palm phones and want to update their hardwares. Palm will not be able to sell a iphone-4 hardware caliber phone to masses 7-10 months after iphone -4 came out. What they need to do is built such a kick *** hardware that iphone and droids need to catch up to us in next 6 months. Then masses will buy palm pre because it is the best hardware, What they need is
--- atleast 3.7 inch screen,
dual core processor before motorola or HTC release it & they will release it soon
1Gb RAM, I know 500G is enough right now, but again we need to build a beast of a device to get the masses
Option of 4G
Front facing camera
resolution better than 960x640 maybe 720
A 1500mA battery
I swear if palm pre has only this hardware upgrades and NOTHING else, millions of people would buy it. On the other hand if they came out with a lame *** pre-3 with 1.3 single core processor, 512 MB RAM, 840x480 resolution, it will be like pre -2, with only people upgrading are the ones with pre. That would be end of Palm and H/P would take over

i'm tired of seeing all these ridiculous wish lists for a palm pre device. how are you gonna fir all that in a tiny phone like the pre! you won't! d'uh!

noone cares about what you think the next hardware should be. we all know what we want. if it comes out, we buy it. if it doesn't, we still buy it! you see how that works?

if you can make a better phone, do it, otherwise, sit in line and let the engineers do their jobs.

and let the homebrewers do theirs.

Idiot, it's about software not hardware.

Well...
Here; in Brazil, we have 4 operators and no one have IP4 to sell in last 03 weeks, because the Apple no has devices to sell here, and each operator is waiting for something close to 60.000 units buyed. Do you know how much EACH IP4 here? Unlocked for $ 1,200.00 (cheaper in high contracts)... =:-o

In this time, the H/Palm could come with the Pre/ Pixi Minus or Plus; wathever... but it's a MONTROUS market that is losing...

Now, I'm saying just BR... can you imagine how is the situation in Rest Of The World?? Waiting for ANY THING, with a good price!!!


Best Regards... B)

pleeeeeez sell in australia!

Or at least, enable true international app catalog. I don't mind importing, but not being able to buy apps with my own credit card is such a dealbreaker!

Get me off Android, Palm!

I like the format of the Pre+ and think the Pre2 is even better. I don't want anything bigger - hate the EVO and Droid design and sizes. The Pre+ works for me. I'm betting the build quality will be better too (although I have no problems with my Pre+ at all.

I think this is a good move. Get some new hardware out with the new webOS while finalizing the HP plans for even more hardware.

I'm excited to get a Pre2 and webOS 2.0.

People stop crying! Its all bussines for HP! The technology to build a super advance cell phone its there, but why on earth would any cellphone manufacturer put the latest technology in a cell phone? what would they sell in a few months after they release such device?
Manufactures release devices with minor upgrades every year to make more money from us costumers, thats how they stay filthy rich!
The Pre 2 is exactly that, a "sequel" to the Palm pre. What did you guys expect? Its gonna have a very similar form factor. The upgrades in my opinion are good. A 1 ghz processor, that once homebrewing gets its hands on it will be at at least 1.4ghz. It has memory that has been proven to work well for webos on the pre plus. And it has a 5mp camera.
The Pre 3 should be a little slimmer, with a slightly bigger screen and higher resolution with a front facing camera and thats it, a move that for a Pre 3 would make sence.

Now lets wait for the announcements for the new devices, new form factors, if those are not up to the market's standards and fails to compete, hardware wise, then by all means, bitch and complain, but as of now, theres no reason for all this crying over the Pre 2!

Ha Ha Ha. You put out something that few want and do you know what happens? Few want it.

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Sprint's facebook page is still full of webos faithful. Not as jammed as the first day, but it's still going. Make sure we don't stop!

has anyone started to think that webos 2.0 is not fully baked? I mean why would the french get it and it not be rolled out to the rest for "months"? Maybe this is just being used to buy some time between phones. Then the pre2 will be sold to those who don't feel the need for an HD pho ne. Don't get me wrong, I want my HD brick of a phone but it will mean a lot of work. New touchstones, all kinds of stuff that will have to be ready at launch. You can't drop the newest latest with bugs in your new os. Let them work it out

Does anyone know if you can Frankenradio a Pre2 with a Sprint radio? Or has the hardware changed significantly enough that this is not possible?

BRIGHT SIDE
On the bright side, once the new glass face Pre-2 comes out, the original Palm Pre will become a collector's item.

The polished-stone inspired Pre-1 design is unique in ergonomics and aesthetics. But the Pre-2 changed the design to a sardine-can look, in order to introduce a more durable glass screen. The result is not as pretty.

I love my Sprint Palm Pre. But, since after a year and a half, I can't get CabonFin nor Bonsai for WebOS, I've got to jump ship. Yet I'll still proudly display my Pre on its touchstone just for decor.