Talkin' Palm - Week ending 27 Feb 10 43
Ouch and Yea!... That's the way the last week was for Palm. Ouch was the pummeling the PALM stock took as guidance was lowered and analysts speculated on what the true meaning was behind the numbers. Things got especially ugly when CNBC's Jim Goldman reported that Palm management was not truthful about the reason why work was suspended at a Chinese manufacturing partner.
"Palm's got a credibility problem, and it's the kind of thing that seems so insidious, and so systemic, that it might pose a deep threat to the company's ability to keep going. That's because the number of people who believe what this company is saying seems to be dwindling."
Things are not looking good. At the end of the trading day on Friday, PALM was down to $6.09, which is perilously close to the company's 52-week low ($5.85 on March 9, 2009). Not a pretty picture.
On the "Yea!" side, webOS 1.4 has been released and packs some nice features including:
- The ability to capture, edit, and share video
- Enhancements in the Calendar, Phone, Messaging, and Email apps to help you get more done faster
- Enhanced notifications
PreCentral's team coverage appears here (over 500 comments) and here (nearly 400 comments and growing) and here.
So basically, this edition of Talkin' Palm is going to squiggle back and forth between good news and downright UGLY news.
>> Engadget's Editor's Choice for Peripheral of the Year is the Palm Touchstone.
>> Why I Dumped My Palm Pre Plus After A Month by Sachin Agarwal
"As I wrote in my previous posts, I think Palm management was fixated on matching the iPhone on paper, feature-by-feature, rather than doing the smart/hard thing and trying to match the iPhone experience-by-experience..."
>> Sprint Palm Pixi Price Drop to $49.99 after instant and mail in rebates
>> PALM Watch. As of Tuesday, things weren't looking too good as pair of analysts ignited a fresh round of hand-wringing over Palm's prospects for a comeback, with the company's performance at Verizon Wireless as the latest source of concern. The stock dropped nearly 10% for the day. Digital Daily's take and Ars Technica's take.
>> Palm CEO's Memo to employees.
...To accelerate sales, we initiated Project JumpStart nearly three weeks ago. Since then, nearly two hundred Palm Brand Ambassadors, supplemented by Palm employees from Sunnyvale, have been training Verizon sales reps across the U.S. on our products. Early results from the stores have already shown improvement on product knowledge and sales week over week. You may have also seen a growing number of Palm ads on billboards, bus shelters, buses, and subway stations—all getting the word out about Palm...
>> Palm Reaction - Mercury News article
"They are a small fish in a war among behemoths," said Ken Dulaney, an analyst who covers the mobile-phone industry for Gartner.
>> webOS Gains Ground. Sindre Lia took a positive spin on things...
"...Gartner's 'Sales to End Users' report for 2009 shows that Palm is gaining ground in a pretty rough market though. "
>> AdMob says... 91% Of iPhone users would recommend device vs. 69% of webOS
>> Verizon Shows Palm Some Love. Seems like Verizon is giving some love to Palm. There was an app press release (Apps for Everyone on Palm Pre Plus and Palm Pixi Plus). And now a Palm device appear among the smartphones in this weekend's ad with the Pixi Plus getting showcased with the Droid.
>> Did you know... HP Smartphones group is headed up by ex-Palm Guys?
From a New York Times article:
"We are trying to figure out whether H.P. wants to be in the smartphone game or not,” said Kevin Restivo, an analyst with the research company IDC. “Whatever the strategy is, H.P. needs to move quickly right now, because we’re in the halcyon days of smartphone growth, and it won’t last forever.”
The article notes that "H.P.’s current head of hand-held products, Steve Manser, previously led product development at Palm, a pioneering smartphone maker, and the unit is part of H.P.’s personal systems group, which is headed by Todd Bradley, Palm’s former chief executive."
- MocoNews reference to HP as buyer of Palm
>> App Watch
- Getting your Grooveshark on. On Tuesday, online music service Grooveshark announced the launch of a native app for devices running Palm webOS, or in other words the Palm Pre and Pixi phones.
- Also, Epocrates for webOS has landed
- New in the App Catalog for 23 Feb, 24 Feb, 25 Feb, and 26 Feb .
>> What's Tweetin'. Here's a quick rundown of what's been tweeted about this week.
I wonder if the Palm Pre's tagline, "Life moves fast. Don't miss a thing," was inspired by Ferris Bueller? -- dfeldman
"Overall for an entry-level mobile phone I can't say that I'm not satisfied, but sometimes you feel that the Pixi Plus is overwhelmed in multi task, and the battery really needs some tweaking."
- YouTube: The Touch Palm Pre Marathon
- Tour of Palm Pre Plus
- Mobility Site: Palm Pre Plus vs. BlackBerry Storm2
~@AppleTrader says, "PALM PRE stood for PRE-BANKRUPTCY?" [shout in orig. tweet] (via @ElliotRonen) - I hope not! C'mon Palm! -- tbc0/Tim Chambers
Verizon's housewife commercials don't make me want a Pre. Can no one figure out how to market webOS? #Palm -- jonfortt
- 2000 Apps Available to US Palm Pre and Pre Plus Users
- Palm Pre Plus Blogger Review & Giveaway - Week 3
- Jason Slater's Quick Tips For The Palm Pre
Do you love your Palm Pre or Pixi? I know I do! Spread and let everyone know how awesome WebOS is! http://j.mp/aRZqoQ #SavePalm -- SeanWF
Why doesn't Palm admit that they haven't created anything stylish since the Palm V & outsource hardware to HTC? WebOS is awesome. Pre... no. -- julioangelortiz
@TechnologyGeek Re Palm Pre - I believe that reports of their demise are premature. They have to reach out to the devs in a significant way. -- Ishkahbibel
The tech blogs are already writing Palm's obit. I hope not. I love my Pre. Get it together Palm. -- mar3nez
Sprint's Palm Pre and Pixi webOS 1.4 Update Hits Today With Video Recording and Flash 10 -- gizmodo_com
- Palm Goes Into Panic Mode, but Soldiers Along With Flash 10 Update for Pre
- Tech: Is the Palm Pre the Velvet Underground of phones
- Scobelizer: Palm's small-screen bet doomed the Pre
That's a wrap!
43 Comments
Chuck was pretty good tonight with a Palm Pre being in the spotlight.
Palms stock ended at 5.93 today.
a few days ago there were a bunch of people hollering $7 was a great place to buy. Now for their finanancial stake i hope the long run proves them right but at the time the momentum was not in their favor
Jack Bauer was multitasking on a pre...
wow
Well, they may want to start hyping evveryone up for this new handset and make it good. Not the creepy chick good though!
CNBC's Jim Goldman better be careful. He may invoke the wrath of the infamous on this board, those such as hparsons. Just because they had bad sales at Verizon doesn't mean management was lying, right?
Another blogger/analyst recently commented that Palm was simply too small to be able to compete in this space. They certainly are now. The punitive punishment by the market is going to make it difficult to recover now.
WebOS is merely embedded Linux with a shell. It will be difficult for another company to see it's value as share prices continue to drop to reflect cash on hand.
So long Palm, at least I've still got several old Treos...
What was your purpose of coming on Pre|Central to post that? You're like those guys that march around with signs about the end of the world, then out of nowhere, he smashes into the window with blood gushing from his face saying, "Death is now your friend."
That's all Android is... Linux in another flavor.
Of course Android is - and it is free to the carriers backed by Google. Palm can't compete with this. Android fragmentation is its (like Microsoft's previous) biggest problem. However, each android phone continues to dilute any 'amazing' features WebOS had (other than the card UI). Mojo was simply too limiting, for too long - regardless of what was promoted.
Now that blood is in the air, who wants to invest in a failed platform?
app catalog app # 1600 will be flash just a guess.
health insurance quotes lejyni life insurance quotes ehda homeowners insurance ugxwlf home insurance >:]]]
app catalog app # 1600 will be flash just a guess.
app catalog app # 1600 will be flash just a guess.
app catalog app # 1600 will be flash just a guess.
app catalog app # 1600 will be flash just a guess.
app catalog app # 1600 will be flash just a guess.
I wish!!
lol now everyone is going to be crazy for flash
where is adobe?!
just a guess. more like wishful thinking
just a guess. more like wishful thinking
To end the double, triple, and quadruple posts -- stop refreshing your Pre's browser. It's not your fault, but that's how to avoid it.
Does the stock price really matter in the end, as long as the phones are selling?
The market is fickle, stocks tend to go up and down all the time; how much does it really mean for it to go down because of doom and gloom among investors?
I'm sure very few Palm customers are actually invested in Palm.
Let's stop panicking; everyone else can feel our panic and may avoid the WebOS phones as a result.
Does the stock price matter? Well, in one word, YES!
Let me explain...
As the stock price falls, investors are less interested in the company and have less conviction that it will be successful. You may know that Palm had a secondary offering of stock several months ago (priced almost double where the stock is now). The money from this allowed them to advertise for the Pre.
No stock offering=very little advertising. Now that the stock has plummeted, investors do not believe in this company. It WILL have an affect, like it or not. There are many other reasons that Palm NEEDS a high stock price as well...i'll leave that research up to those that are interested.
Disclosure: Own a Pre and have since launch day. Also a Palm investor and want them to succeed.
Palm's activities over the past few years are funded by investor losses. Palm has not made a profit in years. At some point the shareholder equity will run out and there will be no more cash to do anything at Palm.
Also, those 1000 or so employees that do everything at Palm probably have stock options as a significant part of their pay. If those stock options are underwater, Palm may start to lose key employees, hurting operations.
Finally, if shareholders are unsatisfied with management performance, as reflected in the stock price, they can remove the CEO or direct the board to do whatever it takes to preserve shareholder value.
So, in the end, the stock price is all that matters.
hmm
Actually... that was a PrePlus featured with the droid...
Actually... that was a PrePlus featured with the droid...
Listen, I love my Pre Plus. I love everything that it does, and as a former Iphone 3G user there is nothing out there better than WebOS.
BUT, much like HDDVD was the superior product to BluRay (at least prior to its demise...and Sony even admitted it after they won), the advertising has been below average, the cash flow is just not there, the product is superior but nobody knows that.
Anyway, if Palm goes out of business I wouldn't be surprised at all. If you tell lies to the public, you have to expect back lash (China thing), and the back lash is the selling of the stock.
FOR THOSE THAT DON'T KNOW...when your stock is priced high and people are buying it, then you have money to work with. That's where the companies get money. Anyway, I love my Pre and I'll be using it as long as it works.
Yeah, that's not a Pixi with the Droid. Its a Pre Plus.
Too bad it's behind the Droid implying it's a good second choice.
At least it's getting some love.
I'm worried, but also starting to wonder what HP could do with webos.....
I don't know what exactly the credibility problem is. A lot of the issues have come from blogs touting the phones as "iPhone killers" before it came out, so people mistankenly expect them to sell more than anyone else. Then you have dumb rumors being posted by major sites saying Verizon will stop selling the Pre, plus they botched the whole launch overall in the first place.
Almost seems kind of unfair. Maybe Palm needs more of a media presence and to interact directly with these people instead of everyone guessing what will happen. Keeping people guessing works for Apple, but it doesn't seem to work for a company that isn't at the top of the market.
Someone up on this thread asked whether does stock price matter if Palm can continue to sell its products and services?
Simple answer is a big NO. One should always know stock price is just an indicator of company's overall performance, to put a numeric valuation of company's value (i.e. asset value) in public's perception. Anyhow, share price is not the primary thing. First thing for a company, like Palm, are its products and services. First someone or some group develop some products and services for sale with a business plan. They then form a corporation, and create a hypothetical number of shares and assign certain numerical value based on projected revenue, projected costs, etc., etc. And then the company starts operating according to their business plan. Still there is no public shares, that are traded in Exchanges. These are called private ownership companies operating under their business plan. SAS (the big statistical software company is like that).Only when a company wants to grow and wants public money (like our savings going into Palm's pocket) for that, the company re-evaluates those old shares and gives to an underwriter to sell the shares to public thru exchanges, and we have IPOs. So shares roll in a company's operation is limited in the sense that it is the very end result showing company's growth or decline in public's eyes, since public wants to know whether there is a possibility of getting a return on their money thru stock share price growth or getting thru regular dividends. Now only way a company can pay back a return on public's money, is if the company makes enough earnings, to have profits, that is to continue to sell company's products and services well enough to show projected profits.
So the MOST IMPORTANT THING FOR PALM (the company in which we are interested)IS TO FIND WAYS TO SELL ITS PRODUCTS. Well Palm with this past weekend's upgrade of WebOS to the version 1.4 proved that Palm has world class products in its portfolio. And Palm also has a very good base of developers who not only develops software for their livings but also helps lots of Palm owners to solve their issues with WebOS. Palm mgmt. has to figure out how to market their products with less amounts of marketing costs. TWO MOST IMPORTANT THINGS FOR PALM ARE: (1) MANUFACTURE 99.99% DEFECTS FREE UNITS (2)FIND MARKETS ANYWHERE IN THE WORLD WHO WOULD SHOW INTEREST IN PALM'S PRODUCTS.
I hope Verizon increases its orders, and At&T and T-Mobile wants Palm's products too. Re energize European sales to Italy, Russia, Czech-republic, dutch countries, Norway,Sweden, Finland,,,and then China, Japan, Korea, Australia, New-Zealand , Singapore, Hong kong, Thailand, India etc. Also in South America.
May be you developers can try to write some good apps to market (Adobe-Flash could help)Palm products on the net.
Did anyone actually read that run-on comment?
Sadly I didn't do my research and Purchased this phone, Dont get me wrong this phone is one of the best phones I ever had but the thing that kills me is that I recently found out Android phones have over 10,000 apps to download and the Iphone has over 100,000 apps. Now im stuck with this phone and the pre app catalog has only 300 apps and 453 here. This sucks im going to cancel my phone and got to the Driod or the Iphone. Thank God I had to pay a deposit my Cancellation fee is going to be 25 dollars. So before I cancle does anyone want to buy my Brand new Palm Pre before I cancle the services. Email me at Trenxtreme@yahoo.com
what a sales pitch!... good luck
This "number of apps" mindset is really strange to me. How many applications do you use on your home computer? And that machine has the ability to at least organize the icons for launching them.
Played with an iTouch and iPhone at a swim meet over the weekend. I've never used such a brain damaged UI before. Hundreds of icons that you have to scroll and scroll and scroll through all in the hope of finding a useful app? Just plain brain damaged. Can't do two things at once? Brain damaged. It was worse than trying to help someone with ADHD who fills their desktop with icons.
Was the scrolling smooth. Yep. Worthless. Yep. But gee ... it is so smooth.
So 100,000 applications with 99.9% being crap. In the end how many apps on any phone are really useful? 20-30? Would people be happy if I published 99,000 different fart apps and naked people apps on WebOS?
And I'm not even going to mention Android besides that their kernel code got dumped from the main Linux source tree. Why? They aren't actively supporting it. Outside of search Google has done many things and yet *nothing* well.
I'm curious. How many of the touted 100,000 iPhone apps do Apple users actually use?
How many of the 20,000 Palm OS apps did any of us actually use? (Tell the truth). Having an app to locate my car in a parking lot is cool, but it makes more sense to just jot down the location in a memo.
WebOS needs more apps, but the gap is not as big a deal as everyone makes out. They should concentrate on their strengths (personal productivity) and let all the people who want to their devices to flash morse code signals go elsewhere.
There is a reason why people are still using legacy Palms and Treo's.
Anyone else watch Good Eats with Alton Brown? 100,000 uni-taskers are wastes of storage. What you need in the kitchen is multi-taskers. Same with applications.
Not thousands on one-shot apps from Geico and Southwest Airlines. But, a *good* multi-tasker that unifies your data and communications. That is the point of Palm's Synergy concept.
Palm needs to continue to focus on moving their bad apps to good apps and good apps to great apps.
[edit with an ad idea]
I want to see Alton Brown in a Palm advertisement. Complaining about uni-taskers and tossing an Android and iPhone over his shoulder. And then talking about multi-taskers and Palm Synergy.
It doesn't look good. My boyfriend went to Sprint to get his new phone and came back with a Samsung Moment. This is after I've talked him into getting either a Pixi or a Pre. He knew I love my palm pre, but it wasn't enough to get him on board WebOS because he didn't want the same phone as me.
I really tried :( The Palm Pre is the best phone I've ever had or used!
If you are out buying a phone just for it's Apps, then go for a droid and iPhone. But I know for me personally I want a phone that will last. I had an iPhone 3G, had major issues with it freezing, I also had a Storm that phone was just a pain to use. All I ever heard was how palm users are palm users for life, sounds a lot like Macintosh users. I own a Mac Mini, but will never own a iPhone, not huge fan. I love the webOS and the ease of use. Anyone can use this phone with no instructions. The droid I hear is complicated and even reps have told me that blackberries are easier to use than the Moto Droid.
I researched this phone like crazy, because I want a good phone. Droid, way to freaking big of a phone it looks like a brick. iPhone, only on ATT and yeah, service for them is crap. This phone is small, works well with a lot of apps running, and so far have had NO issues with it at all. I have friends that have both the Droid and iPhone and they like the Pre, will it ever catch on like the other two, maybe not, but I don't think it will go down like people think. (at least i am hoping it does not)
I hate AT&T and IPhone
On a positive note, I went to Verizon on Sunday to get a second touchstone for work and the Palm display was right in front of the door. You could not walk in without seeing the Palm Pre and Pixi. And, the sales girl was talking to me about how great the phones are and actually knew things about them. As I was leaving, there were two sales people showing Palm phones to customers. This is a smaller market, so maybe things are turning around at Verizon for Palm.