Think Beyond: HP Veer, Pre 3, and TouchPad [recap] | webOS Nation

Think Beyond: HP Veer, Pre 3, and TouchPad [recap] 74

by Derek Kessler Thu, 10 Feb 2011 12:48 pm EST

HP's Think Big, Think Small, Think Beyond event brought buckets and buckets of announcements for the webOS community. From the new TouchPad tablet to the tiny HP Veer phone to the bigger and faster-than-anything-else Pre 3, new devices were out in spades. That’s just the hardware front; there was plenty of news on the webOS front as well. It’s all below.

HP webOS Think Beyond Liveblog | Developer Event Liveblog

Recaps: Veer | Pre3 | TouchPad | webOS 2.1 | webOS 3.0


webOS 3.0


Palm, webOS 2.0, etc





guess i'll have to holster my credit card until summer :(



are any of the new device's coming out for sprint?

You actually expect something to come in the summer.... please list the promises they delivered on. Certainly not anything to do with particular software, upgrade paths, or 'Palm DNA'

or even 'coming months'

Don't loose hope there is still time for them to "Folio" the whole line and come up with 2 new phones to go with a spec bumped TouchPad....

Qualcomm just announced quadcore 2.5GHZ snapdragons.... What is Touch pad again 1.2GHz dualcore?

While I really liked what they showed, I was really disappointed. Like a ton of people have said in the comments from yesterdays stories, I was expecting a new, decent phone (Pre 3) on Sprint within a few weeks because of what some suit said. Once the press conference was over, I went to Best Buy and cashed in my upgrade, got an Evo 4G and am pleased. I'd played with Android before, I like it, but it will take some getting used to. When my next upgrade comes around (early 2012), I will definitely be checking out what Sprint has to offer webOS wise. But for now, I am sorry to say: Too little, too late HP.

it looks like webOS is a waiting game, you wait for and announcement, you wait for the release, you wait for it to get quicker (no pun intended, just mean you wait for updates to speed it up and nothing happens), you wait for a better device, you wait to see if you can get the latest update, you wait all the time, and as a die hard geek, with little money, its getting tiresome! Ive wanted a replacement for my pre since it fell apart!! we should be rewarded with some brilliant releases from the shoddy crap they made before!!! good god if only someone could port webOS onto a htc handset!

Ironically.... HTC is the company that produced the Treo 650 and the Treo Pro for palm.

I wish they diverged from the "pad" route

don't you mean "Veer"ed?

I think as a community, we need to talk more about webOS and less about phones or hardware specs. I think it is the software aspect of it that really matters of HP. If I can print at home from Pre 3 (not sure if that would happen), that would be a killer feature for QuickOffice that no other phones can do. Not even tablets. I don't see Apple supporting hundreds of different printing devices, so they may do what they do the best, force users to do their way, which is partner with one printer vendor (I am thinking Canon) to do the same. But that takes a lot of work. So printing alone is a feature we should be talking over and over to people.

I only hope that HP would focus on these unique features and make it more useful and hard to match. It would be good for HP if people end up buying more HP printers.

Let's forget about the processors, memory, screen sizes, eventually there would be a tablet of any size out there, and there would always be faster new product tomorrow. But integration is hard for any single vendor to duplicate.

I can print from my Evo, no problem. That's what happens when you have a lot of apps made by professional developers. I know you're emotionally invested in the product, but set down the Koolaid and look around.



I have two EVO's and would trade them both for a sold web OS phone. The EVO hardware is great. The Android software and apps are just bad. I also have a iPod touch and Apples apps are way better than Androids. Give me a HTC phone with web OS and Apples apps, and i'll be happy. Im not hard to please.

I am not saying webOS is perfect, but as a user of it, I want to see it being successful. I checked out Evo in stores and I looked at a lot of other phones. None really appealed to me. My wife has an iPhone and we bought an iPhone for my in-laws. So I know what iPhones are like. It is all personal preferences. You can drink your Koolaid, but don't assume what's in my cup.

Even when Evo can print, it is not the same as integrated as part of the product from the beginning. If I have all the time in the world, I would able to figure a lot of things out and may even write my own apps. But I don't and I don't expect a lot of people do. That's why Apple is still successful. If Evo is so easy to print, why don't HTC put out big ads for it? I would give the same advice to HTC, advertise it.

if you think HP are gonna go outta their way to support more than just HP periferals, I think your a little missguided, and the software is delivered via the device, and the device defines the user experience . . . laggy or sharp pictures etc

I get the whole theirs always better speech, but i don't always want BETTER, I just want GOOD, and by GOOD I mean fast (without the prospect of an update slowing it to oblivion) responsive, lagless and bright!

What was the point of yesterday? They have no firm release date for new hardware and most press is focused on iPhone on Verizon. Why not wait till March or April when you have firm plans for both new hardware and potentially some news for your Pre 1 fans.

Instead we got stale news about a Pre2 on Verizon the same day as the iPhone (I'd love to see the sales comparison today) and wave-off for those looking for update news.

I'd love to corner Rub to get some answers and to express my sheer sadness yesterday.

The point of yesterday was to spark developer and investor interest. HP/Palm suffers from a chicken and egg syndrome. Now that other companies have app stores with 100,000+ apps it's hard to break their hold when you only have 6,000 and you're missing some of the key brands and apps that drive interest. What HP is trying to do is say "we're here, we're invested, we have partners, we're moving forward, we have a potential penetration beyond anything you've seen, join us!"

If that message resonates you'll hear larger shops advertise that they'll have apps in time for deployment. That will spur their competitors to want to be in too. All the little shops will want to get in to become the next Rovio. But what we want to hear soon is some of these companies publicly acknowledge their intent. I think that's HP's real goal for this event.


Seems there are just as many questions as answers coming from the event: No price points, no release dates, no carrier information, no Netflix, no Hulu+, no Shazam.

I guess the only answer we did get is that existing webOS phone owners were being shut out of the 2.0 (and Flash) upgrade, even though we have been promised that for over a year.

To anger current - soon former - customers and developers.

Pre, Pixi -/+ - No webOS 2 for you?
TouchPad - No gesture area for you? webOS 3?
Pre2 - webOS 2.2?
Pre3 - No gyro for you? webOS 2.2?
Pixi2 - um, Veer - No gyro for you? No replaceable battery for you? webOS 2.2?

Developers - Target webOS 1.4.x and mojo framework, but not support new features (microphone, Exhibition, etc.), and sell your app today.
Target webOS 2.x or 3.0 and not sell your app until "summer".

There's no accelerometer in the Pre3? Are you kidding?!? Or am I reading that wrong?


Yes there is an accelerometer there is no gyro

Oh, I AM thinking beyond them .. to what replaces them.

Think Kick In The Teeth.


Yesterday, HP looked us in the eyes and said, "We are all a bunch of liars."

It is time we look them in the eyes and said, "So long, suckers."

I just did. Downloading apps for my brand new Evo. It's amazing, the variety, and the QR codes are really helpful.

boy hp thinking is very limited! if this is their beyond thinking.

"Think Beyond"

I see what they mean now. Don't look at the words they actually *say* because they are lies. Think "beyond" those words to read between the lines.


It's funny! Because Palm did the SAME mistake with the Pre minus, waited till summer to release it LOL, sooo I think its funny!

Exactly, after being told by the CEO that they wouldn't make that same mistake again...a week before they made the same mistake again.

Seriously, why tell the world that the new products will be available weeks after being announced, then have no dates, no prices, no final builds of hardware or software, no new apps to support the unfinished hardware and software, no updates to "legacy" devices, and no sniff of a future roadmap. They've been telling us for weeks that things have changed, but it seems like nothing has. HP still has 10 months to make 2011 "the year of webOS" but I don't think this is a good start.

they are thinking beyond their customers..when thats who they SHOULD be thinking ABOUT!

i still have my original pre from sprint. bought it opening day june 6. love the phone but am now tired of seeing what this thing should be able to do by watching what others can do with their android. the waiting game is pathetic.

every step of the way with this thing has been a waiting game. you will get flash ... in 2027 .. you will get webos 2.x .... you will get it .. you will get it .. oh, never, nevermind .. upgraded hardware is coming we have an exciting event planned to make the announcement and hardware is ready now to back it .. well i mean in 4 months anyway ..

i've played with ios and android and don't think they really measure up to webos. alas their breadth of hardware options makes hp/palm look like my samsung from 1999 in comparison.

contract is up soon. let's see what sprint has to offer then. i refuse to switch to att or verizon over a phone. i may have to go evo or something similar when it is time.

i am thinking beyond for sure .. beyond this fiasco called hp/palm/webos.

prove me wrong hp. i ain't waitin' 'round forever.

* sigh *

Is it just me, or are they again asking to be unsuccessful in the "young" market, just by selling a device called "[q]veer"?

I hate the misleading advertisement. When the Pre3 is sitting next to the Veer, it looks long and big. I'm just pissed. I switched back to the og Pre, to wing myself off of the EVO, only to see that the new hardware, is not really that new... Yes, yes, yes there is the glass, the 1.4 ghz, the cameras, but that isn't enough! There's no external memory, nor on the tablet either - which is a super negative to me.

But anyway, i'm crestenfallen.

So does the TouchPad have a gesture area? Does it go all the way around? I have yet to see anyone use it in any of the videos. If not, will all existing apps have to be rewritten to work with the TouchPad (regarding the back gesture, etc.)? Or will the TouchPad even be able to run existing apps at all?


Correct. On one of the Engadget videos, HP rep says they left it off. *sigh*

There is no gesture area, I believe they will use the screen for that but they did not show anything about that and no video I have seen of journalists at the demo booths asked about the back button/gesture . There is however a dedicated button to go into card view.

just wanted to run this buy everyone i have an idea for hp/palm's next product release. i think they should come out with a 10 key flip phone with a 1.2 in diaginal black and white display, running webos 4.2 of course. they should anounce in early in 2012 and release it some time in the summer of 2020, right ahead of the newest iphone. i think is how they can regain market and make webos a respectable mobile os. thoughs, cuz this seems to be their strategy.


If they can do it in Egypt, HP can do it here.

I hardly log on here at all. But i do come here to see what kind of cool updates we are going to get like the 2.0 for my pre plus. When i heard that we were going to get the update i to was waiting for it but never got it. I gave up on on palm a long time ago i am now going to get the iphone 4. What would have kept me from not getting one was the cool phones that was in the contest here a while back man those were some really nice phones with widgets and big screen faster proceesing all around goodness. Stupid HPcrap failed to notice those phones and not put it out there. Would love to get my hands on those contest phones thats for sure

:(( It's been a rough week for us Sprint Pre owners. First, we get the FAIL of a dual-screen copier phone. Then, we get to know about a bunch of stuff that won't be out until September (they said summer, and we know how Palm likes to "technically" be right...summer ends in September). The iPhone 5 and iPad2 will be old by the time we get anything from these guys.

I try not to comment much, but I had to say something to keep from jumping off the ledge after seeing this craptastic week!

I want so badly to stick with HP WebOS and these new devices look pretty cool. The biggest thing I fear is that the app support will never even come close to comparing to iphone/android apps. The Palm Pre was supposed to be "revolutionary", first to support Flash, better multi-tasking, etc. But thus far it's been nothing but disappointment after disappointment, broken promise after broken promise. I love the underdog and generally despise the leming type approach to my tech stuff, it sucks to say this, but I have lost my faith in the underdog here. If "sightly spec bumped stuff in a few months" is the best HP's gauntlet of support can do then I will have to look at other stuff. Why even have an announcement of stuff that's not yet ready? In 6 months time all of this is going to be only barely "on-par" with other stuff coming out. If your stuff is groundbreaking and revolutionary it'd be ok for people to wait, but this stuff is not. Did you see the video? When Ruby whipped out the Veer it was silent... nothing... no applause at all. When he whipped out the Pre 3 he had to instruct the crowd to cheer... that should be a very clear signal that the audience was not impressed with what you're putting out, this was not "Thinking Beyond". The Touchpad looks pretty sweet, but again if there's no apps for it, it'll be dead in the water.

I was prepared to buy stuff off contract this time, but being a Sprint customer (yes I choose my carrier first) I doubt any of this will come my direction anyway, so I guess I'll limp along with my Pre- (which is now again stuck in headset mode - 4th time now) until I can get the upgrade credit (in the coming months). If this stuff hasn't taken off like wildfire, I'll probably look elsewhere :-(

Yep,you could here a pin drop in the place when pulled the phones out...this is the same reactions consumers will give.

I watched most of the video last night (I was F5'ing engadget's page during the show to see the pictures).

When Ruby stood on stage and pulled out the Pre3, even sitting here alone staring at my computer, my face blushed and felt embarrassed for him when he was met with dead silence. He even had to "Well? C'mon!" to get the crowed to do SOMETHING. My face deepened in shade as my head begun to shake.

Kinda sad, really.

First of all...Kudos to PreCentral for outstanding coverage. Thanks for feeding us great articles and the liveblog. There is a lot of negativity on here today, but it's certainly not directed at you! Great work!

Not sure what to think yet. I, like everybody, have been invested in Palm for a long time. I have no problems with my Pre+. But, looking forward, I will have to look at all the options on the table. Palm is no longer my only option.

I guess we need to get over the fact that Palm is no longer. There's no reason for an emotional attachment now that the company has been absorbed and integrated into HP.

I think the greatest tragedy of the "big" event, was that HP did nothing to convince us that we NEEDED another webOS device. Certainly didn't convince us that we should wait for "the coming months." I didn't see anything that set these three devices apart in a significant way.

I'm still a palm and webOS fan, but after yesterday, my eyes will probably be open to all platforms when making future decisions.

In the past, I was never a Palm fan. Yes they had good installed apps & features but their devices were too bulky. Then the Palm Centro came into my life. I loved it. I could use it for work, fun & play. There was almost nothing that little phone couldn't do. Then I was ah-inspired by this revolutionary WebOS. I thought that the future was now (and the iEverthing world would die in a ball of fire). So what did I do, the first moment I could get a Palm Pre I jumped head long, know that the keyboard was bit small, the slider wiggled, and that my power button one day would not work (which happened the day HP said they would support legacy phones with 2.x).
I saw CES and all the tablets and phones and Androided things but was confident that Feb 8th had all the answers and I was going to get a new device weeks after which again was promised.
What did I get...I got slapped, HARD!!! How do you wait a month after to CES to give a press conference and say we aint got ship for you until later. I believed in you HP, I will always believe in WebOS but I think I'm going to have to become a Android like everyone else. I will keep my beaten and battered Palm Pre (minus) for historic sake, but I don't think I can await a "sometime in the spring" date for a new device of any kind...

I really hope HP comes to their senses and comes out with an announcement SOON to Pre owners telling them exactly how much the upgrade cost will be - which, at this point, better be damn near free after the shenanigans they pulled yesterday.

It feels a lot like Charlie Brown lining up to kick the football. We really thought this would be The Time - only the football got yanked away AGAIN.


> #ThinkBetrayed

That's the funniest damn thing I've read about all this yet! Kudos!


I love my orig Pre.. Was more than excited for the anouncement about the new products. Then as I read the blogs of the event, I get more and more dissapointed with each minute that passes. I hove not played with android phones, but am going to see what they have to offer on Sprint now. I may still wait until summer for the Pre3, but not as loyal as I was going to be to them..... I also wanted the TouchPad, but sounds like the iPad2 will be out first so will probably get it instead..... Don't anounce if you are not ready to ship or price your product!

well i am disappointed to see that most everyone else feels the same way i do. i like all of you was soooooo overwhelmingly excited for the pre. it came out and i really loved it. well the webOS part of it. the hardware was not great but i put up with it cause i thought it would really take off. instead all i found were more problems and a ridiculous amount of spam apps. there were some quality apps and homebrew but otherwise nothing. then i had to switch to the evo. and ever since as much as i love the evo and android my heart has always been with webOS. so i waited through the change of ownership and all else. then this 2/9/10 even was announced. i thought like everyone else here it would be as groundbreaking as the pre. maybe in terms of hardware or software or hopefully a real actual great marketing campaign. and sadly that was blown up like hiroshima and nagasaki were. the phones look about as underwhelming as aguilera's national anthem at the superbowl. the touchpad (horrible name) actually looks good. but as others have said, what the hell am i goin to do with other then surf the web and send emails? the app store for palm sucks ass. they've had nearly 2 years to build it up and they have what a hole (yes pun intended) 6,000 apps maybe most of which are spam. Don't tell me that cause you have angry birds and pandora that means anything. look i really really want to buy something webOS. i really really do. but after yesterday i can't. i'm done. i'm giving up. and the worst part is that if these monkey idiots wanted to make some real money all they need to do is ask this website what we want on our next phone and how to market it and we would supply them with the answers to make rubenstein or whoever steve jobs rich. so sadly friends i must say i'll keep checking back now and then but really all hope is lost. unfortunately i would have to give webOS 1.5 years tops to stay afloat.

The announcement was a disaster. Instead of new and exciting reasons to support webOS we get a Jumbo- and a Shrimp-edition Pre, plus one me-too tablet. Except that we must wait for some unspecified period of time to get even those. I've been with Palm since the Pilot but even the die-hards are dying.

I think everyone sees the pattern here...hp/palm is do everything to mimic Apple.

They are keeping the same type of devices with small upgrades, one 10" tablet and launching on the eve of Apples iphones.

I'm glad I left for the Evo on launch day and didn't wait 18 months for this.

All I got say is hp be prepared to get pounced on by a gauntlet of phones and tablets from htc, Samsung, LG that they seen what you got they will counter and bring it to the market before you.

oh boy, how do I fight with these emotions? I bought my Palm Pre + in May 2010. As it stands right now, I get the earliest upgrade January 2012. Then I can purchase the Palm Pre 3. My question is why bother??!! I'm really worried that HPalm will neglect me the customer like their doing right now, and especially the way that the Sprint customer has been treated! I really love the product but the company running it needs to be "taken back ti the woodshed"! SHAME, SHAME, SHAME!!!

Well its MWC in the coming days not weeks or months and its htc and Samsung's turn to introduce new android and possibly Wp7 devices.

i have been an hp printer user for 15 years.

i have loved my palm-now-hp pre- since getting it and was never worried when hp bought palm.

with all the rumors flying about the potential for webos, the new tablet, the connectedness between platforms, etc .. i was even considering waiting to buy an hp computer to replace my aging dell.

seeing how this has unrolled for we lowly ORIGINAL supporters of webos (albeit sprint takes some blame here too) leaves me less than excited to continue to support hp products.

they aren't acting like the spoiled apple child. they are acting like the bitter bastard step child apple never wanted.

straighten up friends at hp or i will find someone else to pay ridiculous cash for printer ink to.

neither is fun to be around.

OK, I think I got it, with the names and company changes....
POP = Palm Original Pre
POPP = Palm Original Pre Plus
POPi = Palm Original Pixi
POPiP = Palm Original Pixi Plus
Enter HP and buys Palm so now we have...

HPPP = HP Pre 2
HPV = HP Veer
HPTP = HP TouchPad

There in case you were all wondering how to differentiate all the models.
Just be careful when you go into Costco this summer and ask for the HP TP as they may send your to the paper products section,.....

They should have a completely oreo'd Pre-, with face cover cracked above the usb port, just to the left of the Veer in that picture.

What is really sad is the fact that BB Playbook has one of the greatest features that made webOS great. Not just the Card Metaphor (stolen or not) but Swipe Gestures. If people didn't know any better they would swear that the Playbook is a webOS device (that's before they start using it).

Went out and got an EVO....what is the difference between late summer and couple of months? By the time my contract is up for the EVO Sprint's prices will probably match their competitors so I won't mind switching to another better coverage company and get better coverage and faster data speeds. I really like WebOS it is much more intuitive UI than Android. That is really the only thing I miss the EVO does everything that I want it to do except faster and on a bigger screen. I may come back in a year and take a closer look at the tablet that looks really nice and could be where HP hits a homerun. The Veer and 3 won't go anywhere unfortunally unless they have a TON and I mean a TON of marketing and price point homeruns, even then I don't think the Veer will go. If their market are teens with that thing don't teens want to listen to tunes and who wants to carry that adapter around, but maybe HP figures they have iPods for their music. HP is going to have market their tailends off to get these phones to sell and keep WebOS out there in the phone market otherwise it will end up going the way of MeGo (I think that was Nokia's new OS they just dumped). GOOD LUCK HP you have a lot of work ahead of you in the "coming months".

New HP/PALM slogan: ' We don't keep promises, We just make them' !

I don't understand what all that was from HP about the leaked specs didn't match the products, or that products would be delivered quickly after announcement, etc. HP is showing they don't know how to drive this machine.

They didn't show anything that made me say wow, other than the PC possibility. But I'm guessing they'll fine a way to run that into the ground some way too.

My wife may be interested in the Veer, but other than that I don't see anything that would pull an Apple user over to this side of the fence. Everything seems 'me too'. HP needs to fix that message, but I don't see them driving that.

still wishin I would wake up and realize hp buying palm was a bad dream. I was hopin for htc webos :)

I'm craving Pre3 and Touchpad right now.

i'm going to create a countdown app that has an alarm that goes off every day to remind you that absolutely nothing has changed...

I wonder what kind of money Rube is getting in stock futures from Apple to kill off Palm from the inside.

Dear Palm/HP,

We have been together since June 2009. What an exciting time that was?! A revolutionary new mobile operating system with lots of promise. Frequent OTA updates. The first to be getting Flash! A document editing program on the horizon. Oh the good times...or so I thought.

However, after all the broken commitments (Flash, international paid apps, 2.x updates, doc editing, voice API)and broken promises that it would be better in the coming months, I've come to realize that our relationship has been pretty much one sided. The time has come in our relationship in which I think we need to move on.

I'm tired of looking like a jackass to my friends when I talk you up, only to be let down or proven a liar myself when you renege on your commitments. Hell, I can't even do things my Instinct could like voice commands or visual voicemail.

It's not me. It's you. Know that I will be looking at other options.

I agree, if HP was my girlfriend/wife, this would be the last straw and no matter how much I loved her we would be breaking up/getting a divorce. This whole thing is bullshit. HP tanked Palm and WebOs.

I understand the no 2.x for older phones, pre3 seems nice. My problem is that now on my 4th pre- and the ear piece doesn't work(no its not the headphone jack). I was hoping for a new phone that I could replace my current one... Alas, in the coming months.

I started out on Palm/Handspring PDA's, and have stuck with Palm since then, but this was the final straw for me. I see no reason to wait around until summer for the possibility that HP may come out with the Pre3, which doesn't look any more capable than something I could buy tomorrow with an iPhone or Android phone.

And after all of the broken promises, and, in particular, the failure to come out with a word processing app, Flash, etc., I'm unwilling to take anything on faith any more from Palm/HP.

HP can no doubt afford to keep WebOS phones alive for a couple of years longer, but it's going the way of Betamax and I'm getting off the train now.

Did you see the lackluster in the applause when they introduced the **** and the Pre 3?? Rube was like.... COME ON PEOPLE!! Like I said all along, HP bought Palm for WebOS, not to make phones. All we got was a Pre mini me, and a Pre Baby Huey... nothingness. The Pee Pad is wicked smhaat though.

Had and enjoyed using a Palm 750 with Windows Mobile 6.0 for last 4 years. Very reliable, bounced off concrete a few times, stylus scratched the screen, but still useable. Gave _great_ voice & worked in remote locations where iPhone users keep screaming "Hello! Are you still there? Damn! (or suitable expletive)"

Eventually got bored waiting for Palm/HP to get something to the market, so looked at RIM products. As our company uses Lotus Notes/Quickr apps, and BBES hooks in with Domino, the Torch looked interesting.

Long story short: great phone, tight integration with corporate world, gives _great_ voice (D'oh! its a phone..., although some vendors seem to forget this ), works well in remote locations. Battery is almost identical to the Palm, but different connectors & lugs. BB OS6 still has a few inconsistencies, but I'd expect 6.1 to fix most niggles. Summary: it works!

I buy phones, not worship brands. Whatever works best _at the time you need it_ is the best choice. Otherwise you're buying promises from the lineal descendants of the Rev. Sun Moon...