UK carriers taking a pass on Pre3, jolly 'ole England not so jolly 76
Wed, 17 Aug 2011 5:00 pm EDT 
This week’s not turning out to be a good news week for HP so far. Tomorrow HP will announce their Q3 earnings, but in the meantime they have to deal with bad reports about the HP TouchPad’s sales, the softer-than-soft launch of the HP Pre3, and the fact that their legacy products are disappearing from carriers with no replacement announced. And things aren’t going to be looking up in the UK either – no carriers there currently sell a webOS phone, and it looks as if none of the carriers are interested in doing so in the future.
The folks over at The Inquirer reached out to the United Kingdom’s mobile operators and asked specifically about the Pre3, and the responses they got were not encouraging. O2 has no plans for the Pre3, nor does Vodafone or Three. Orange, which has put up a support page for the upcoming webOS smartphone, has a more nuanced answer: they’re going to offer the device, but it won’t be through any of their brick-and-mortar or online stores – instead the Orange Pre3 will be available through “indirect channels,” which we’re taking to mean third-party resellers such as Clove.co.uk, Play.com, and Mobiles.co.uk.
UK carriers might not be interested, but that doesn’t rule out the rest of the world now, does it? Well, it certainly doesn’t rule it in. O2 Germany’s already taken a pass, and we can all but declare Sprint an impossibility at this point. In fact, we’ve had nary a peep from any US carrier about the phone, but given that HP “expect[s] to share additional information for U.S. customers soon,” perhaps we won’t have to wait much longer to find out.
Source: The Inquirer; Thanks to joat and Jeff for the tips!
76 Comments
HP has failed- if they continue to fail, in two years, I will permanently leave webOS (my TouchPad and 1GHz Pre-)
Are you that confident over your Pre-'s durability?? I'm not expecting that for mine (third one) even though it has no problems so far.
They don't have two years. 2011 is (was) their last chance to get any significant share, that would keep them on the map. But with their attitude, and blowing one product launch after anotherhow could they succeed? And especially, making outrageously stupid decisions, Pre 3 was their last chance to stop the terminal disease. Should be their first.
Apparently, they are more inclined to "soft launches", than to webOS success.
Given that last failed non-attempt, webOS is now officialy dead. No white 64GB TouchPads are making any difference
Just wait until they release the Pre3 on Cricket, we'll see some numbers then... /sarcasm
O2 belongs to Telefónica, the only carrier in Spain that launched the Palm Pre. In the first days they charged users with 20€ for having the Pre, even if they came from other carriers. Vodafone Spain also brought the Pixi Plus. Both of them saw that none of the (then) Palm phones was a success. So.. It's normal that in Europe nobody wants to buy thousands of phones nobody will want to have...
At least those companies have the balls to come out and say they're not going to carry it. This is something we've been asking Sprint about for months. There won't be any love lost when I switch to ATT.
This is why the touchpad isn't doing well. Hp putting the tablet before the phone is like putting the cart before the horse. The best way to get webos in consumer hands is via a subsidized phone.
They should've spent the last year rebuilding carrier relationships and getting enyo onto a flagship all touch device for every carrier. Kind of like samsung did with it's galaxy S line.
Now they're left trying to convince iphone and android phone owners to buy a webos tablet.
That's a very interesting observation, and one I haven't really heard before. Your words ring true for me, and I wonder if HP really had a plan at all?
"That's a very interesting observation, and one I haven't really heard before. "
...you are being sarcastic and I didn't get it, or all that time here you were only posting stuff, and not reading other ppl comments? There is a bunch o ppl here (me included), who were banging posts about how WRONG their order of releasing devices is, beginning with one that no one asks for (Veer), continuing with one that almost no one asks for, and that has no installed user/fanbase to build on (OouchPad), and ending with still not-released-slash-soft released Pre 3, that people are DYING for, since original Pre????
Yes. I agree. Tablets are still a luxury item. Most people who want a tablet go for the iPad.
Smartphones on the other hand still have a large potential customer base. There are a lot of people still with feature phones. Carriers are really pushing those folks toward smartphones. HP shoulda concentrated on the smartphones. They DEFINITELY should have made sure the Veer and Pre3 was ready and updated to fully integrate with the Touchpad. That is a nice selling point and a good way to have people buy into the ecosystem. HP really mucked it up.
I have a feeling the Pre3 may not make it to my carrier (VZW) if UK sales are bad. I also don't like any of the android phones now or the ones coming out soon. I'm hoping iOS5 and the new iPhone have vast improvements with the notifications and multitask gestures. Or maybe the Veer will come to VZW after the exclusive (ha!).
If they had the Pre3 out already, they could advertise the ability to call from the TouchPad using the Pre3 (or other webOS device). They be stupid.
What does Russell Brand have to say about this?
ha
lol that made me laugh. But he will be very disappointed.
Lucky for him, he's made the jump to America. Probably because he got inside word from HP that the Pre3 was coming to the US but not the UK.
Well played, Russell.
Im hoping that this is the last of the Pre-HP Palm phones (see what I did there :P) that will be released, with HP controlled hardware soon. Hopefully, having to swallow the entire R&D cost and having complete control will give HP some much needed motivation to promote to customers and push carriers hard.
Still, my iPhone 3GS has given up the ghost so I may get an unlocked Pre3 regardless :D
This is really sad. Its like watching someone you really love throw it all away and you can't quite figure out why. I had to make the switch a few months back so I got a Nexus S 4G and I have to say I like it, but it certainly isn't webos. I hope they get their sh.. together or they'll just burn out to nothing
perhaps selling through carriers arent as important here (eu) like some people think. The price is right for the pre3 and the veer. Market them ftlog!!!
In the UK (which is where the article is about), it's vitally important, the vast majority of phones are sold via carriers, so if no carrier is willing to have this phone, then it's pretty much over before it's started.
The price might be right for the veer but it's never been sold in the UK.
This is crazy, I mean crazy!!!!!
To counter this news, I expect an article on the front page any moment about how the Pre 3 is number 2 in the market. Of course, it will be a survey. 100 imaginary beast were polled to see which phone they would prefer if there was no such thing as an iPhone, Droid, or WP7. It would gain 10% of the vote while BB got the other 90%. wOS loyalists would cheer.
thats funny
i had my heart set on an upgrade for a pre 3 but also someone else other than me may get to buy a phone which has an os worth waiting for.
sorry to say but it looks like the end is near for web os :(
(still rockin a pre plus, oreo/cracked screen and everything else)
Game over. Goodbye webOS, hello Windows Phone 7.
Sprint was declared the culprit for lack of Pre 3. I wonder if all these other carriers will get the same treatment.
Just went shopping for a phone today. My Pre- screen cracked last week and I spent $100 to get it replaced.
I looked at the Android models available from Sprint... wow I didn't realize how behind the Pre (and yet to be released Pre 3) is in hardware.
If all the other companies can put out new models almost every 3 months, why on earth is it taking so long to put out 1 phone model?
WebOS can't possibly win if they can't get these phones out every few months.
I gave up on wanting a WebOS Tablet as well. It's behind on options (I saw the Motorola dock for their Proton 4G phone, the tablet needed to have that dock with the HDMI output on it).
Rob
Uh, perhaps because they are all the SAME D*MN PHONE? Go back in time...
-Copy the HTC HD2
-Go forward in time from 2009
-Press "Ctrl+V" every 3 weeks or so
-Android is successfull
How hard is it to repeat something over and over with no innovation. If I was motivated enough, I guarantee that I could take the last 30 Android slabs, Photoshop the logos and screen contents out and line then up and take money bets you could not say which was which.
All Palm phones are the same too. Physical portrait keyboard and touchscreen. All but the Pixi are sliders too.
Not a whole lot of form factor difference between the Pre, Pixi, Pre Plus, Pixi Plus, Pre 2, Veer, or Pre 3.
The sad part is, that the HD2 is just about the same internals as the pre3.
Nevermind the fact that my Galaxy S 2 is light years beyond the pre 3 in all aspects of hardware.
HD2 is on FIRST generation snapdragon running at 1GHz with Adreno 200. Pre 3 is snapdragon S2 (2nd generation) 1.4GHz with Adreno 205. They are NOT repeat NOT the same.
Hardware wise in the vertical slider market there is no better spec'd phone than Pre3. The best alternative is Dell venue pro which is a gorgeous device albeit a bit bulky. However, windows Phone 7 device are still stuck on HD2 level hardware (snapdragon S1, Adreno 200 and no front facing camera).
There is no amount of sugar available at Imperial Sugar Company that could make anyone here or anywhere else think that webos is on the rise. Just face the music, stop writing these articles about surveys that don't matter just to be false hope. ITS NOT GOING SO GOOD.
if no one wants the pre3, no one will want any other phone hardware until they see some very impressive spiking going on in the charts. And if there are no devices on cell carriers, then this whole interconnected long-term future plan of the cloud and being connected doesn't exist.
webos is in trouble, and when the numbers are released, you will see just how much faith you have put into a phone/OS that is going nowhere fast.
It's totally the fault of Best Buy Sales Reps.
they need more training!
We should spam their FB and Twitter pages! /sarcasm
Done. Bold 9900 here I come - with PlayBook in tow.
What pisses me off is they had it all, and fumbled it. It was better than the iPhone when it came out - it really was - but now it still can't keep network time in the UK without an app.
Bye.
Yeah, it might have been better than the iPhone 2G, but didn't the Pre launch in 2009? At that time you are looking at iPhone 3G, 3Gs. The Pre was no comparison. Cards, Multitasking, Gesture area, Homebre may be important to webos fans, but no the general public. When HP and "others" realize this maybe, just maybe you'll get awesome competitive phone device. How many millions of android and ios device have to be sold before people realize that what make webos special to you does not translate to the public.
Bundle it with free dental.
LOL
This is why I'm now lugging a gigantic EVO 4G brick around instead of my svelt Pre-. I dropped the Pre into a lake (funny story about a fat guy in a little boat...) and had to make a choice - upgrade to something with 4G and get my money's worth out the $10 Sprint extra-charge, or buy a used Pre on Ebay. No
THIS IS SUCH UTTER BS... GDM why the F#@K is webos the only OS I can really live with... Tried Android only to come back to this **** .. ARGH!! man, if no one wants it just f#@king put it on sprint or something. Wasn't it HP being snotty and being like all verizon and at&t....
/vent
RIP WebOS 2008-2011.
WHAT IS HP DOING?????????
Being HP..
They're still looking for the customers who want to buy a tablet but not a phone.
Steering the superior Titanic into the inferior iceberg.
EPIC FAILing
Why can't HP just find carriers who will allow the phone on their networks and sell the phones themselves. That way the carrier won't have a warehouse full of phones if it doesn't sell putting all the viability with HP. If HP succeeds and gets a foot hold on a little marketshare their next product may have a little more carrier backing.
What like MetroPCS?
Lets face it with the iPhone now available on all four of the UK's networks usually on a 24 month £35 per month contract with unlimited texts and 500mb of data plus being shoved in your face constantly through TV adverts and by people walking around all searching for their phone when it goes off because they all have the same ringtone is it any surprise to us that the Pre 3 was not picked up by any carriers?
All people see in the UK are iPhones and 100 trillion apps (or they use a Blackberry if they want to go on a weekend of rioting and get some new clothes and phones to flog down the pub).
If HP had any sense they would ditch the retail market and just go after the business sectors only way I can see webOS growing which is a shame as like everyone else who uses or has tried webOS, it is a far superior OS just not backed up with sales, apps or anything else really! :(
I'm happily now working with my upgraded VZW Pre2 and new Touchpad. They are working very well for me. I think they are better than the alternatives.
If HP has any sense, they will adjust their tactics to meet market conditions, not give up on retail and consumers, and keep at it. I hope HP validates their statement that they are in it for the long haul.
**** i think i'll be unhappy when i get the pre3 but i'm still getting it :/
No carrier support means no people, means no apps sadly.
Think this might be leaving webOS when my contract is up and moving to an android device.
Bit confused by everyone blaming it having a keyboard,lots of people do want keyboards. I know people who get by with iphones cos they want the apps but if they had a keyboard version would go for that especially in the business world. What its lacking is any knowledge about the platform/phones and carrier support. Sure an option for all touch would be nice but why would that in theory at least have a better spec?
Carriers want a slab phone. Period. Blackberry is dying right now making keyboard phones.
Believe me, Rubenstein was replaced due to his terrible execution, the Envy team was put in charge of next tablet design and hopefully phones as well. HP understands that things have to change ASAP.
I can only hope that HP is as serious as you claim.
could it be....that it is hp who didnt want the carriers and not the other way around? like hp shunned sprint?
Could be a lot of things, but not likely.
Yes, that is it. HP snubbed carriers so they wouldn't have to exert the effort in having a succesful product. The carriers hurt by the snub are saying it was they who passed on the phone and then implying only few would purchase it.
Is it meth or a head injury?
"Is it meth or a head injury?"
ROFL
I guess the big question is who is abandoning who-
Have the cell phone carriers 'hung up' on HP/webOS, or does HP figure that with their 'Might' they can sell phones that have no carriers.
In either case, this speaks volumes about the supposed 'might' of HP.
I fear that this might spell the end of webOS, except on the occasional toaster.
Yunno... I couldn't make myself get a Sprint Pre Minus, knowing that Verizon had the Pre Plus, so I waited for it to come to Sprint - it never did. But ever since webOS was introduced at CES I wanted a webOS phone... so I waited for the Pre 2 to come to Sprint - it never did. But, wait, the Pre 3 will come and my waiting will have been worth it. I have been sitting on my upgrade for 2 years now. Picked up the BlackBerry Tour off-contract so I could have something to tide me over until the Pre 3. Now that it's vaporware and I've gotten some experience with BlackBerry OS I'm going to finally use my upgrade on the Bold 9930 coming next week. Goodbye webOS - I really wanted to get to know you, but I never got the chance...
Remember in June of 2010 when us Sprint Pre Launch owners got fed up with the non activity and dropped the Pre to move onto the EVO, with the thought that we'd check out the EVO for a year and see what was up with Palm in that span of time to see if they would come out of rehab and blow our socks off. Many loyalists said we would be sorry because we would be stuck for a year and be dealing with HTC trash and we'd be sorry....
Well...
HAHAHAHAHAHA!!
Spot on Sir..... although, when the Pre3 does come out - you do realise there will be several hundreds claiming its the second coming....
And if this didn't seal the deal, I don't know what else will. Bye Bye WebOS
why continue a unsuccessful line??????? i just dont get it. the pre did not meet expectations. the pre plus did not do any better. the pre 2 bombed. well maybe the third time is the charm..... i dont think so...... they need to dump this phone and hurry up and release a slab phone before christmass..... i dont really see them doing that so i dont believe webos has much of a future....
Face it folks - WebOS is going the way of the dodo - or rather, will be relegated to HP printers and PC accessories....the Pre3 needed to capture the imagination of the public and developers, it didn't....so much for HP megabucks bankrolling speedy development and hardware release....this makes me respect HTC so much more now.
I've owned a Nexus S for almost a year now, and am eagerly awaiting the nexus prime, I want to get a tablet this Xmas, and I know they'll be a multitude of choice.... Anybody who thinks they'll be satisfied with a Pre3 and touchpad by xmas (when IPhone 5 and Nexus Prime are out) is kidding themselves - wake up people, its because we're all so rabid about Palm that they keep pulling this sh*t with us - leave, en masse, and then maybe when fansites close, homebrew dries up, sales drop off, they'll either A. Come good on hardware or B. speed up the inevitable and can it.
I didn't think it was possible to have a softer launch than the Pre 2, but HP seems to have outdone themselves yet again!
After I get my hands on my PRE3, HP, you can burn in **** for the way you handled WebOS. Jon Ruby - u deserve to get FIRED. And Mr Apotheker, you're fkin useless and you need to stop making promises you can't keep. Your marketing team and your phone designers all need to be FIRED as well. **** U HP. Release the dam PRE3 and then EF OFF
A lot of anger here, wow. I'm in the UK and my pre3 arrived yesterday. Amazing phone. Better than my old iPhone4 and so so so much better than my pre2. Paired with a TouchPad it is a dream. It really saddens me that they have so little support from carriers but lashing out at HP isn't going to help.
Sites like these are used to judge public opinion. You are all destroying what little might be left of webOS / HP. Be constructive. Anyone can just vent from a position of ignorance. I don't know all of the ins and outs of carrier dealings. I do however know the phone is mighty fine and it is a real shame more people won't get to see it. A real shame.
OK, back to your venting...
The carriers may expect HP to invest in marketing the device so they don't end up with a phone no one knows exists.
How much marketing did HP do for the Veer and Pre 2? Basically none. Who thinks that the Pre 3 will be any different at this point? Is it being advertised in Europe right now?
HP has thrown all their eggs in the tablet market and seems to just be dumping the phones on whatever carrier will take them, so it's no surprise that most carriers are saying no thanks.
HP seems to still be coming to terms with the fact that the tablets won't sell without folks first owning the phones.
It doesn't actually matter how good the phone is - basically, if you want a carrier subsidised Pre3 in Europe (and basically the US as well) you're stuffed. That's why folks are so angry - plus the fact that anybody could have told HP the strategy they chose wouldn't work.
I can understand the soft launches if HP are indeed only caring about the enterprise but if they don't have carrier support then the enterprise isn't going to want any Pre3's either.
HP must really have blown it with the carriers to have no partners in Europe - not even the smallest network (3) in the UK. You'd think the carriers would want to offer something different to Apple and the mass of Android phones - but I guess the Pre3 doesn't excite them at all.
The way to revitalise webOS was to get the Pre3 out first on a couple of carriers and follow it up with a 3G TouchPad on those same carriers to build the ecosystem - they could then have released the wifi TP quickly after that.
No carrier support means webOS is dead - very few people want to buy a phone outright upfront, and even less will by a webOS phone like that, why should they?
Total fail...sad
I know its optimistic but isn't the Pre3 the end of the Palm legacy and we're still really waiting for HP to come up with their own phone? Probably this is the end of the Pre but maybe not of webos.
Yeah, I suppose we can look forward to a webOS toaster.
HP is blowing several fairly large opportunities here.
The most glaring is with all the Android patent disputes how could they not swoop in to Samsung, HTC, LG etc. and being licensing immediately. Give those handset makers a sweet licensing deal and flood the marketplace with WebOS devices.
If they really want to make a footprint in the mobile market they have one more chance coming up but they need to be quick about it. Make SEVERAL WebOS phones with LTE and catch the 4G wave before it really catches fire. If they don't come out with LTE WebOS phones before the iPhone comes out with an LTE edition things will look much bleaker.
They have one chance left to stand out in the crowd...don't mess it up
Wrong, that chance has come and gone already - that was earlier this year when they made that bogus promise of announce and release products within a mint, at this rate - we'll see a new WebOS phone and MAYBE tablet next (2012) autumn...where do you think IOS, Android and WP7 will be by then?
this is the time for HP to travel to a new frontier....the direct smartphone manufacturer to customer purchase service....use your power and money and buy some cell towers and by-pass the carriers....
Cell Carriers are a dying breed they will not last forever....
control the airwaves....i said it first
i think
Maybe the carriers are holding out for the return of the creepy chick marketing campaign?